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Es 20/20

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  • Es 20/20

    Now Anouncing the ES 20/20
    In January 2018, Ernest Sports will reveal a revolutionary new launch monitor, the ES 20/20. With enhanced Doppler technology along with major advancements in camera technology, this launch monitor will perform at a level that has never been seen! Through direct measurement of both club and ball data, the ES 20/20 is a dream come true for golf professionals/instructors, game improvent seekers, simulation enthusiasts, and club fitters

  • #2
    Hmmm claims sound familiar to another launch monitor by them....hope it turns out a little better this time around

    Comment


    • aja
      aja commented
      Editing a comment
      That's mean....

      But pretty accurate!

  • #3
    So all they have to show is an artist rendition this close to the launch date, I wonder if they have a prototype built yet or is that what they plan to release so they can get more test dummies to work for them for free. Well sad to say it doesn't seem that it is really going to matter. I have some emails from Jim and myself I would like to share on this subject. I have tried to work with Ernest Sports as you can see from what Jim has to say in the first email, you can also see in his second email where he tells me a new test unit is being sent to me, but it never showed as well as the golf balls or many other items that would be sent according to Jim. Then there is the one I sent him trying to see what would be happening on the ES 20/20, and as you can see from what he has to say in the one he sent back to me it doesn't look good even though he says in the first email it was designed from the input taken from those of us who sent feed back on the ES-16. Then there is the third email I sent to him, well looks like no one at Ernest sports is answering any of my emails now. I have been led around and lied to for way to long being promised new improvements that have never shown up and being told as to how I would be satisfied or given my money back, yet from what is going on now that is far from the case, but then it is far from over as I see it. I have saved all my communication with Ernest Sports along with the advertisement that the sent and then changed after I had bought my unit.

    Comment


    • shimonko
      shimonko commented
      Editing a comment
      I commented the same on another forum - two months away and it's not even an artist's rendition, just some very amateur looking photoshop composite. I suspect the E20/20 may look nothing like that picture and all will be revealed only at the PGA show. I would expect a dual radar/camera unit to be similar to the ES16 - sitting beside the ball rather than behind. This E20/20 looks a bit thin to have radar cones collecting signal a ball well in flight.

  • #4
    Thanks for sharing....those emails say a lot.

    Comment


    • #5
      They do say a lot and this is one I meant to post with them, that is very relevant to them and also says a lot and it is referred to in one of the emails I did post. On one email I wrote "he was very friendly" it was suppose to read "he wasn't very friendly" my mistake. Mistakes do happen I understand that but not over and over and over again.

      OnCore golf is trying to raise money to build a "Genius ball" as they call it and if I had the money to spend I would invest on it as they are up front and saying just what they plan to do and just what you will get for you money. To me Ernest Sports sold us a bill of goods that didn't come anywhere close to what it was claimed to be to explore and build the product they wanted to build using the cash and knowledge they got from us to do it. To me to donating knowingly and to put forth an effort knowing what your return will be or not be is one thing. But to be told how great a unit is and how well it will perform only to find out it is no where close to what was claimed, and then to be told that to get the new unit that will supposedly do all that the one you bought was claimed to be able to do is very much something else indeed. I feel Ernest Sports not only lied about what they were selling us but also used the knowledge we provided them to build their new product and now wants to leave us behind. It was even suggested by Jim that I sell my ES-16 to someone else which I see now that had I done so it would have gotten them off the hook to a very large degree.

      Comment


      • #6
        Should not have to invest in squat for a 5000 unit IMO all there doing from what I see is extorting more money and the 20/20 might be a new fools LM for suckers that don’t research and see a bunch of eye candy marketing.

        Comment


        • #7
          I find your comments a bit severe... None of the systems are 100% trouble free, even much more expensive ones like Trackman ! I have quite a few clients that are very happy with their ES-16, all recent updates have truly enhanced its performance. And you must admit that for $5000 right now, there isn't much choice available out there ! Obviously new technologies and products will continue to emerge and to make our initial investment rapidly obsolete, that's life as we know it today, like it or not. It remains that ES-16 is still a great value today to have both club and ball data !
          ES is a smal familly operated business that has come a long way and that will continue to try hard. Personnally I look very much forward to their new ES 20. It's their chance to impress us, and I am sure they will do just that

          Comment


          • #8
            I have 4 friends that have tried to play and to sell the ES16 as its unusable 2 of them now will not sell there system because they do not want to take advantage of someone with no knowledge of how the system works. send me your contact information and i will send them to you and if you give them a full refund of the unit i will definitely apologize for my last comment. but we will see if you do this my guess you will not. a 5000 es 16 compared to a 1700 skytrak, and the skytrak blows it a away is obsene most the time you get what you pay for, but not in this case what so ever.
            Last edited by aeroburner; 12-05-2017, 05:08 PM.

            Comment


            • #9
              Two of the last ten shots I just hit, this ES16 did not even read. The light just stayed green. Battery is 70% charged, ball placement is perfect, lighting is just right, I'm on a good mat... It does crap like that all the time. It loses Bluetooth connection all the time--I should not have to make sure my computer is still connected before hitting a shot. That along with other issues like it not working as promised outdoors are among the main reasons that aeroburner is right.

              We were promised certain features they were not delivered. We were told those features would come within a month. Well, it's been over a year and where are we? Is it better than a Skytrak? Well, it gives you clubhead information. Am I confident in that CALCULATED clubhead information? No, not really. It is accurate a lot of the time, but in a game like this where your stats matter what's the point of having inaccurate information about your shots? Especially when you shelled out $5k+ for those stats!!! A GC2 without club info would at least give me accurate ball info every time.

              Comment


              • #10
                APGOLF:
                The criticism aeroburner and Baller have placed on Ernest Sports and the ES 16 has been well earned. Now, I have come to terms with my ES 16, but this thing is not easy to like. Baller is right, one will be hitting shots and all of a sudden it will not read and if it does read the shot will be way to far, to short or off line. One can turn the unit on and, for example, a well struck 8 iron will show 20 yards short and the unit can then be turned off and back on and the same 8 iron strike will show 20 yards long. One can hit an iron, very slightly fat, and the data will show 10 or 12 degrees right horizontal launch angle and one can see the ball hit 1 degree or less right of target on the screen. That variation on horizontal launch angle can also occur with a well struck driver hit off of a tee. Club path, club face and ball impact position are often so far off it makes the data useless and lack credibility. I often spray foot powder on my clubs, so I know where I am striking the ball on the face. Putting is horizontally off 4 to 6 degrees at times which makes putting unhelpfull and unrealistic.

                Now, it is not all bad. The vertical launch angle is very accurate. I have measured it many times and it is always within measurement error. The unit can measure the backspin, side spin not so much, difference between a premium ball and a lower spin model and the ball reaction on the greens shows this. The club head speeds for the lower loft clubs, 27 degree or lower for me, comes very close to my Trackman/Flightscope numbers. The new chipping mode works well and those launch angles and carry distances are close for the most part.

                I try to make sure I perform a clean restart every time I use the unit and I limit the loaded programs to need drivers and windows basics. When the ES 16 gets off track, I reset it by turning it off for a few seconds and then back on, although sometimes that does not work and it requires a recalibrate and sometimes even that does not work very well. I set my system up such that the target line and the unit is parallel with that target line. I have spent a lot of time and made many measurements to insure the target line is on the money.

                I had a Skytrak and would have to agree with the above comments that it is more accurate. I also have to believe that the ES 16 can be made as accurate or even more so, but they have not done that yet.

                Like I said, I have come to terms with my ES 16, but it is not a very user friendly unit to say the least.

                The folks at Ernest Sport have taken on a tough technical challenge. I want them to succeed. Still, they have to make the ES 16 produce results that are at least reasonable when compared to their advertising or they will have no credibility with the ES 20/20.

                I am curious about the folks that are happy with the ES 16. Who are they, how do they use the unit, what type of computer system do they use? This type of info could be very useful to those of us having issues.
                Last edited by Stonebattle; 12-06-2017, 10:59 PM.

                Comment


                • #11
                  I would like to hear about those happy with their ES-16 units myself, I have told Ernest Sports about the issue with the system being turned off and back on for sometime now and they act as if though I am the only one to ever have that problem or the only one to have the problem with the horizontal reads. I also told them about it being sensitive to which lighting was being used indoors and again it was if though I was the only one seeing that. I would like to see them succeed as well but I don't want to have to pay to be a beta tester or be stuck with a unit that is no where near what I was told it was when I bought it. I was told before I bought my ES-16 it would preform as well or better than a GC2 with HMT, I had already discounted going to a Skytrak, and was told that the ES-16 was way more of a launch monitor than that, yet from what I have seen and heard I would guess the Skytrak to be the better of the two, I know it wouldn't take much to out preform the ES-16 I had.

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    Originally posted by APGOLF View Post
                    I find your comments a bit severe... None of the systems are 100% trouble free, even much more expensive ones like Trackman ! I have quite a few clients that are very happy with their ES-16, all recent updates have truly enhanced its performance. And you must admit that for $5000 right now, there isn't much choice available out there ! Obviously new technologies and products will continue to emerge and to make our initial investment rapidly obsolete, that's life as we know it today, like it or not. It remains that ES-16 is still a great value today to have both club and ball data !
                    ES is a smal familly operated business that has come a long way and that will continue to try hard. Personnally I look very much forward to their new ES 20. It's their chance to impress us, and I am sure they will do just that
                    I don't have clue as to what $5,000.00 means to you, but as for myself I am a disabled veteran living on a fixed income and it means a lot to me, that is almost two months pay for me. I had to take out a loan to buy the ES-16 I had and counting the fees, TGC, the ES-16 it's self and the coverage for it I paid out $6950.00. Now I am paying interest on that and all I wanted to do was play some golf with the family when the weather was to bad out side to go play. Which hasn't happened it didn't take to long before the wife and youngest grandson refused to even try and play on it, seems their club head speed wasn't fast enough for the radar to pick up properly. I asked for a refund shortly after getting my unit because it did not preform as stated it would, and it wasn't just a little off it was way off, false reads no reads and so on. I was asked to give them a chance and if I would they would make it right for me and I would not be held to a time frame for a full refund. I gave them a chance then another and another and all it has gotten me is aggravation and wasted time waiting on promises that have gone unanswered. Now you say none of the systems are 100%, do you think that means you can say what you want about them and make claims as to how good they are knowing they can not preform as claimed. If you were sold a car and it would not run properly and you could not count on it, would you be OK with it because others had no complainants about theirs? You say "It remains that ES-16 is still a great value today to have both club and ball data !" but how much of a value is it when you can not trust the data it gives you? Ernest Sports may very well be a small family business, but when you neglect your customers and make empty promises doesn't that also count. I made a deal to settle with Ernest Sports, I agreed to the settlement even though I felt cheated having settle on some equipment I really do not want, a copy of TGC, and $2250.00 back. I sent in my ES-16 in and was told as soon as it checked out I would be sent a check, and the check was promised to go out no later than today. Today I was told that the check could not be cut until all the post I had put up on this form showing Ernest Sports or it's product in a bad light had to be removed. I feel that brings any agreement we may have had to an end and makes it all nul and void. At the time of our agreement I didn't know if I could remove the post that I had put up on the form so I would not agree to something that I did not know if I could do or not I said I would check into it and see what could be done. Now I have no ES-16 and no money and looks like I am going to have to take Ernest Sports to court to get any thing from them at all, every agreement I have tried to make with Ernest Sports has come to a dead end, with me on the losing end. You may find the comments a bit severe, but I find Ernest Sports to be unable to or unwilling to make right on a product that they sold with it being unable to preform anywhere near as it was advertised. What would impress me is to see Ernest Sports take care of the customers it has, and not just me but all of them.

                    Comment


                    • Baller
                      Baller commented
                      Editing a comment
                      I don't think your comments are severe at all. you should not have to negotiate to have them make it right. I once had an issue with another product and it wasn't made right until after I posted on the forum. He gave a sincere apology and did make it right in the end and I did what I could to remove my posts, but was told the removal ability is limited.

                  • #13
                    Originally posted by APGOLF View Post
                    I find your comments a bit severe... None of the systems are 100% trouble free, even much more expensive ones like Trackman ! I have quite a few clients that are very happy with their ES-16, all recent updates have truly enhanced its performance. And you must admit that for $5000 right now, there isn't much choice available out there ! Obviously new technologies and products will continue to emerge and to make our initial investment rapidly obsolete, that's life as we know it today, like it or not. It remains that ES-16 is still a great value today to have both club and ball data !
                    ES is a smal familly operated business that has come a long way and that will continue to try hard. Personnally I look very much forward to their new ES 20. It's their chance to impress us, and I am sure they will do just that
                    I think you have the market cornered on happy ES16 customers. As they say niche marketing

                    Comment


                    • #14
                      Wow, that's crazy messed up by ernest sports keeping your machine hostage on top of not honoring their message to you to not holding you to a return period.

                      Love that they think they were smart in telling you to take down the negative posts, but then in doing so has now made their reputation so much worse in my eyes and I'm sure most others reading it.

                      ES, how about you just make a product that works for the people spending their hard earned cash or give them their money back and you won't have worry about bad posts on a forum. ES has done this to themselves and they want to blame you for it, that's disgusting.

                      ​​​​​​​So much for freedom of speech in their eyes. After reading all this I know I will never do business with them, and feel for the people that have gotten screwed by them. They should be ashamed for doing you dirty like this.

                      Comment


                      • #15
                        Thank God I didn't buy an ES LM . Not cuttitng a check until all the posts are removed?? Wow..

                        Comment

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