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PhiGolf WGT Edition

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  • PhiGolf WGT Edition

    Anyone seen this? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...t&term=PhiGolf

    I know a couple guys who bought the original PhiGolf Club Sensor off Kickstarter last year. It works pretty well, gives a good display of club path, both backswing and through swing. Build quality was really good too. Their App had a cool clubface alignment thing as well; you can see the club face moving open or closed at address on screen before you swing. I’ve played WGT many times, the graphics are really good and I’ve talked to a few guys who play WGT using their SkyTrak launch monitors and they told me it’s good. $2000+ is too rich for my blood right now so SkyTrak is out for me...I wonder if this would be a good setup for significantly less? I’m thinking WGT app mirrored to a big screen with a solid club sensor could make for a pretty good setup, especially considering the price. If anyone has any info on PhiGolf or WGT as a sim, please give me your thoughts! Thanks!

  • #16
    I received my PHI but have not been able to play with it. I should have time this weekend to set up my net and CCE mat and put it through its paces. Currently the WGT integration does not work, and there is not time table for it to do so...which is a bummer IMO. However, I bought this thing because it is supposed to have a nice little virtual range that will track swing plane and shot shaping. Distances I hope are similar to "real" golf shots in this mode as well.

    As far as distances in WGT, I asked this question and did not receive and answer from the dev team. I truly hope it is not tied into the WGT ecosystem! I am a big fan of that "normal" game, but it has taken me a few years and lots of grinding to get top tier clubs with solid distances. If I had to buy the virtual clubs again, I'm gonna be more than a little ticked. That would mean the PHI is simply a "controller" to play the game and not an actual sim/training device...which would stink and be rather pointless. WGT could still make money selling their virtual golf balls with better attributes and the avatar clothing and other special effects. Because, to me, it should make sense that if PHI was truly trying to make a sim here, my swing should be MY swing dangit!

    if they still look here, this is my thought process: based on my swing, have a baseline of say 150y for my 8 iron...

    with the "free" basic white ball, maybe it goes and average 145y (to replicate an actual range ball or super low end ball) with minimal spin and stopping power

    for 250 in-game credits you can purchase Callaway Chrome balls (3 pack normal sleeve) that actually give my the 150y and have mid tier spin traits

    then for 500+ credits you enter into the Pro V territory that would give you a boost to 155y with exceptional spin.

    in my head this actually mimics real golf and would be a source of constant revenue for WGT as the balls are a consumable that you need to buy more of every few rounds. (which while I don't want to have to keep spending money moving forward...the PHI is still only a $99 device and WGT is technically free, so I kinda get it...as long as we don't have to rely on buying virtual clubs too)

    all that being said, I'll come back with some impressions in a few days!
    Last edited by natural320; 05-17-2019, 06:12 PM.

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    • #17
      On the Phigolf, I've now had a chance to give it a 'beginners' test with real clubs and the swing stick provided. I'm seeing what other people are saying in that the distance doesn't seem to be completely accurate for the swing however I've gotten a couple of measures that were very close to what I was seeing on the Optishot when I was comparing them directly. So they can be similar if the swing shape is correct for the phi-stick. I believe the swing shape determines the flight distance and that's where you're going to see the difference. It's quite good with real balls and it seems to capture most of the spin and in ball bounce pretty correctly. WGT software is intriguing and that these are Android and ISO apps only. Don't believe there is a PC version at least none that I found. With the Android app, you pretty much have to sign over your life to the software it opens your phone up to just about every conceivable sensor that's out there. So location is needed phone pictures, files, ... all of that stuff is needed to agree to their terms. The gameplay is exactly what you get with WGT but with a lot of free swag coins to buy things like clothing, fashion clubs, designer golf balls, do-hickeys, and gadgets ... etcetera. While it's pretty realistic for a phone-app game, the view is not from the first-person shooter POV, but from a person standing behind an avatar golf player, and you watch it play, instead of the simulation of the real thing for a first person. You do direct the swing with your Phigolf chip. With its 9 degrees of freedom a gyroscope, accelerometer, a magnetometer it gives very precise measurements via Bluetooth4.0. It's very responsive. The Internet Of Things (IOT) sensor plugs into the top of your golf grip but pushing the phi unit spike into the top grip hole. Sadly this does not work well on all grips as the diameter of the grip hole varies from grip Brand to brand. So you may need to get an Exacto knife to expand the hole (just a little) in your grip to easily move the Phigolf device from Club to Club (but only if you're using real balls or a real set of clubs).

      I found the swing stick to be useful in front of the television if for example, you are watching one of the tournament and want to play along with the professionals or if you're traveling and wanted something to do to burn up some time and get in a little exercise, it's a perfect 'fun' golf thing to do. Kids and teens would probably really like it. As far as a low-cost serious SIM, stick to the Optishot, R-motion or Tit.ttle X. If you're actually trying to do golf Improvement all those who will work, and the choice comes down to software (TGC vs E6 vs Optishot). WGT needs to be changed so you don't have to go to the keyboard every swing. Same with TGC and E6 btw. Optishot has a nice sim game flow with no interruptions unless you intervene and others should learn from them. So far, that's what I see. I'm experimenting with the Phigolf using the Laser Pro C200 projector (a 720p HD Android TV laser projector) that I hope to share more info on. Have a good Charles Schwab.
      Last edited by Chuck; 05-26-2019, 02:47 PM.

      Comment


      • #18
        Well this has been disappointing to say the very least. The distances and flight paths have been all over the place for me, and that was in both wgt and the phi apps. So I went to the phi's, newly updated, website... Where the FAQ now says it is not recommended to actually hit balls with a real club! Are you kidding me???

        I double backed to the crowd funding page, and, clear as day, it says you can hit balls and practice while you play. So I've definitely been taken for a chunk of money, and I'm pretty ticked. I'm attempting to contact them for a refund, unless one of y'all would like this thing for 100 bucks plus shipping to your door. I'd be out about 10 dollars in that scenario, but if someone will enjoy just swinging a club with this thing, then you can have at it.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Gamecock82 View Post

          Chuck , can you give me a little more info on the phi golf? If I don’t go skytrak, I think this will be my best bet. I’m not too jazzed about erecting shaft sensors in the r-motion/tittle or taping my club heads for the optishot, so I think phi golf meets what I want, from a simplicity standpoint.

          Ive seen some mixed reviews on it. Mostly finding that the club distances are all off by about 15 yards or so. That wouldn’t bother me as much, but how is the shot shaping? To me, this is more of the necessity than distances are. Does it produce a shot shape that you would expect? Replicate a slice when you typically hit a slice? Draw when you want it to draw? Etc.

          Now, for the gameplay, are there any range modes? Or is everything through WGT?

          Are your shots based off of the clubs in WGT? I.e your distances will be capped based off a video game club (Unlocked as you progress); I couldn’t hit more than 220 on driver in the phone game. Or does your actual swing performance match the result.

          Any insight on the above would be more than helpful. Thank you for always providing insight, I really enjoy your reviews.
          WIlson Campbell was asking about phi-golf compared to a SkyTrak. If you can afford the SkyTrak, that's what I would do... I'm just hoping that sooner or later someone will have a sensor like SkyTrak but with a $500 entry point to ownership. My wife wouldn't let me hear the end of it if I spent a $1500 bucks on a 'golf toy'. Even though I've heard Dustin Johnson uses one. Maybe sometime in the future, I can get one. Until then, I can play a variety.

          Comment


          • #20
            I'm now in an email conversation with the Phi team, and they confirmed that this technology doesn't work with hitting real balls...
            which is sad because they wrote that hitting balls would be an option in their indiegogo campaign, and also posted video of it "working" on a driving range.
            I have requested a refund, so I hope they will honor that since I was literally sold a bill of goods. Definitely a bummer because I was very excited for this thing.

            Comment


            • #21
              So they, technically, WILL honor a refund...
              however, they want me to ship it to South Korea, on my dime, "as cheap as possible", whereupon they will examine. test, and determine if I can have a refund!

              ummm. that's ok. I'll keep this thing and just use foam balls or something
              offer for its sale will stand if anyone wants it for what it is! cheers y'all. and the search for the perfect budget sim/sensor/trainer continues!

              Comment


              • #22
                Hi there. Yes, we remember our exchanges with you. Yes, there is a slight difference with the analysis results when using real golf balls due to the vibration. The developers have been working on some updates.
                Last edited by Phigolf_team; 09-02-2019, 03:58 AM.

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                • #23
                  I took the Phigolf stick over to my Brother's house this weekend for a BBQ party that he was hosting and we had a blast with it. Okay given it's not a full-blown simulator, the fact it worked on the Android and I could *cast* that screen over to the TV made it a very nice and quick system to set up. I have to say that casting your phone screen over to the television with just a few commands is pretty slick. Anyway, it was the hit of the party.! The kids loved it as well as the adults when taking shots in our longest drive contest. So that's one thing I will say about the PHI golf system is that if you know what you're paying for and you know what you're getting it's definitely worth the investment. Fact is it's pretty fun in a group. If you're gonzo over golf and have a party that you want to entertain, this is the device for you. As far as real ball strikes and a real simulator experience, you're not going to get that with​​​​​ this device, but it is great for parties.

                  While the hardware is there for real ball impacts and real club mounting, its not easy to move club to club like the clip of R-motion or TittleX, nor the real ball placement of Optishot or Skytrack. The tracking is excellent though. But the real issue IMHO is software. It's not an E6 or Optishot or TGC. It's an Android thing making it unique in this market. Bottom line though it's a thumbs up in spite of the full-sim deficiencies.
                  Last edited by Chuck; 09-07-2019, 06:42 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Phigolf_team Phi Kim Phigolf
                    Have you considered releasing a course creator for Phi Golf? The PhiGolf sim app is a fun app for casual sim play, and I’d love to have the ability to create my local course. Given that the sim runs in mobile devices, a basic PC-based course creator would be a game-changer. (And it would make for some awesome additions to the PhiGolf tournaments that you run.)@PhiKim or
                    Last edited by Anansi; 09-15-2019, 07:18 PM.

                    Comment


                    • Phigolf_team
                      Phigolf_team commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Hi Anansi! Good idea - it would be awesome to design your own course. I have sent this to the dev team and we hope to see it in the future!

                  • #25
                    Originally posted by Chuck View Post
                    I took the Phigolf stick over to my Brother's house this weekend for a BBQ party that he was hosting and we had a blast with it. Okay given it's not a full-blown simulator, the fact it worked on the Android and I could *cast* that screen over to the TV made it a very nice and quick system to set up. I have to say that casting your phone screen over to the television with just a few commands is pretty slick. Anyway, it was the hit of the party.! The kids loved it as well as the adults when taking shots in our longest drive contest. So that's one thing I will say about the PHI golf system is that if you know what you're paying for and you know what you're getting it's definitely worth the investment. Fact is it's pretty fun in a group. If you're gonzo over golf and have a party that you want to entertain, this is the device for you. As far as real ball strikes and a real simulator experience, you're not going to get that with​​​​​ this device, but it is great for parties.

                    While the hardware is there for real ball impacts and real club mounting, its not easy to move club to club like the clip of R-motion or TittleX, nor the real ball placement of Optishot or Skytrack. The tracking is excellent though. But the real issue IMHO is software. It's not an E6 or Optishot or TGC. It's an Android thing making it unique in this market. Bottom line though it's a thumbs up in spite of the full-sim deficiencies.
                    Hi Chuck! Glad to hear you and your family had a blast using Phigolf. We also appreciate your feedback as well, and I have forwarded them to our team. Happy golfing!

                    Comment


                    • #26
                      Mine arrives this Thursday, looking forward to online play. I'm not expecting gc2 accuracies, but more fun and all The WGT phi tournaments. Hopefully they're handicap tournaments🤪

                      Comment


                      • #27
                        Nice. The Phi-golf has a great sensor. It's a full 9-degree sensor; with a dX-dY-dZ accelerometer, Rho-Theta-Phi gyroscope, and X-Y-Z magnetometer, and high-speed Bluetooth. It's like the sensor found in the Samsung Android phones, or the Apple iPhones. It's a heck of a sophisticated device. There are so many things you could measure with it on a golf club. For all of the math to work out, you really do need club length since it can only measure the motion of the very tip of the handle and it won't really know clubface speed without club length. Their standard estimates for length and club-head-mass seem to fit the average. By comparison, the Tittle-X is just 6-DOF, and R-motion is also just 6-DOF. With the addition of a magnetometer, you get an orientation value (if nothing interferes with it, like fluorescent lamps ballast for example). Phi should be able to make a device driver (motion capture) that would compete with the best of them.

                        Comment


                        • Phigolf_team
                          Phigolf_team commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Hi Chuck, we are impressed! I've shared this with the team and they are thankful as well. We appreciate your comments and we are working on software improvements for our customers.
                          Last edited by Phigolf_team; 11-29-2019, 02:31 AM.

                      • #28
                        Originally posted by Jeff Thomas View Post
                        Mine arrives this Thursday, looking forward to online play. I'm not expecting gc2 accuracies, but more fun and all The WGT phi tournaments. Hopefully they're handicap tournaments🤪
                        Hi Jeff! Thank you for your purchase, and we'd love to see you in our monthly tournaments both on the Phigolf and WGT app!

                        Comment


                        • #29
                          You know what Phi_team, you really have a winner with just a little additional physics modeled. If there was some AI in the software, there really isn't anything you can't measure with the Phi. You should have some physical parameters set, like club length, shaft-flex (?), etc, and you can probably determine Real-vs-Foam-vs-Air based on the swing data from the Phi. What I want to do is take the Phi to the driving range and use your app as the swing recorder system. I have the Phi attached to my Android-TV and with the stick, I enjoy the App you-all developed. I've yet to get through 18 on WGT though. In the deep stretches of winter to come, maybe. Have you all at Phi looked at driver creations for other software like E6?

                          Comment


                          • #30
                            I'm impressed with what I'm reading of the Phigolf Simulator and its ultimate potential. However, I've got to be honest and admit that I'm not that much of a fan of WGT's photo mosaic method of presenting golf courses. It looks good in still screen shots, but it feels a bit static in action. I also have a problem relating to the oft distant positioning of the golfer within the closest course picture to the player's actual lie on the course. It feels more like I'm controlling a remote control golfer than being able to visualize my perspective as the golfer being from a fixed swing camera perspective, directly behind and at close proximity to the golfer.

                            I'd love to see Phigolf hook up with The Golf Club 2019 and be an integrated control device in that game. TGC 2019 seems to be quite popular with Pro Tee, GC2, and SkyTrak users. I think it would be a great fit with PhiGolf... I know it would compell me to buy a Phigolf simulator if it were to come about.

                            Comment


                            • Chuck
                              Chuck commented
                              Editing a comment
                              I agree 100% with you. I would love to see a Phigolf on TGC2019 or one of the other SIM packages. I'm not a fan of WGT either for the very reasons you mention; flat, static, and annoying. I like their home-brew android sim. Perhaps it's the game engine, but if the did the sim with a game engine like "Urho3d" then maybe able to get good realist landscapes.
                              Last edited by Chuck; 12-07-2019, 04:19 AM.
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