Advice or dissuasion

[cmckelvmi]

I apologize for the long post!

Hello, I have been a happy Skytrak user for the past 17 months. However, I have always been interested in devices that have HMT ability. I am looking for insight from users that have GC2 with HMT or similar devices such as GCQuad. First concern I have is cost versus value and of course my layman abilities to be able to capitalize on the technology. Basically I am a terrible golfer and have this fantasy that I can help my game with more data. I rationalize this thought by how much I have improved since getting my SkyTrak. My handicap has improved from around 24 down to 13 and has stabilized recently around 16. However, when I video my swings or use things like foot powder on my club face to determine strike pattern I don't always know what to do with that information. Will getting real information on my club data help me if I don't know what to do to make an improvement? Also, is it true that I am limited to using software such as TGC (lifetime license holder) if I go to GCQuad or GCHawk (doesn't have HMT yet)?

Something else to consider: I have a Swingbyte device and have yet to properly incorporate the data into making improvements. For example the Swingbyte will indicate I have an in-to-out swing, but everyone tells me I have an OTT swing...?

Please advise me or dissuade me! Thanks in advance.

[Iron Brandon]

HMT is a nice tool, but you necessarily don't need it to improve, especially if you cant interpret the data. Really to get a good picture of your swing, you need to get a PC cam (I suggest a OVA2710) to record/view your swing down the line at 120fps. Set the cam up at hip level facing yourself down the line where your hands go thru at setup. Download Kinovea (its free) and set the delay around 5 or 6 seconds after selecting your camera. From here you can make a practice swing; practice your take away; down swing etc. The delay will give you a chance to look up and see how you look from down the line on your screen/monitor. You will soon get an idea of what you need to improve on. Coming over the top, taking it back to steep or to shallow, early extension, or whatever it may be that you are working on and/or struggling on.

You can also record yourself and go back and review in slow motion to add lines and such like many coaching pros do within that Kinovea software. Its really helpful. Combine that tool with your GC2 practice range (I use FR1). You can quickly find out why your ball reacts the way it does from your cam footage and ball flight.

I promise you, having a second set of eyes, whether its your own (via using a cam/recording software) and/or someone else watching you reduces your guess work. From my experience when improving, what you feel is "right" and "comfortable" is not always right when looking at yourself from a third-person POV. This will force you to make drastic changes and feel what you thought was wrong is actually right. You can monitor your progress a lot quicker and effectively this way imo.

Remember the ball never lies!

Please note: It also helps to understand golf fundamentals (which I assume you do) so you can self analyze your swing accordingly, if not, having a golf pro to assist you is a must.

[cmckelvmi]

This is great info, thanks! I am very interested in getting a camera/s set-up to help analyze my swing. I think I have a fair understanding of the fundamentals. However, what I have learned through instruction is the proper golf swing feels foreign to my actual actions.

[StuartG]

Can someone chime in here. I think im missing the big picture on this hmt gig. I now have a gc2 but please tell me how hmt will help me with my swing tempo and length of swing and position half back plus club position at the top. I reworked my swing with these changes to eliminate a2 way miss. Straight or right trying to take the left side of the course out of play.
What do I need the hmt for. Sell me on this and maybe I'll get one someday but at this point i'm not following. When I hit the ball I can tell you what part of the face I hit it on without hmt or foot spray.

I'm not going to try and sell you on anything but since you asked I will tell you how it can be used. Whether you think those methods will help you or not as opposed to other options I'll leave up to you to decide.

HMT or any LM club data can show and identify issues with: club path, face to path, dynamic loft (shaft lean at impact and flipping), AoA, and even efficiency of the swing (swing speed). Yes it can tell you about impact location - but so can a $3.00 can of foot powder spray. And no, it doesn't tell you why you have issues, what's causing them, or how best to fix them. BUT it can provide feedback on whether the changes you are trying to make to the swing are really helping the problem or not.

Personally I think it's a horribly inefficient approach unless you already have a good fundamental understanding of at least your swing and your faults so know how to identify the real problem and how best to fix it. And even then, video is going to do a better job of that anyways. If you don't have those fundamentals down many will just be floundering around with trying to fix issues they don't understand. Even the best pros aren't going to know what the core problem or best way to fix it just based on the LM numbers - they are going to need to see your swing. On top of that, most amateurs don't really have a good idea of what numbers really mean in terms of the quality of their swing and get way too fixated on things at a much higher level than they should be.

But that's just my take on the subject.


P.S. Relying on feel for feedback on impact location is fine for irons - but horrible for drivers and most woods/hybrids for a wide range of reasons I wont go into.

[Wizard of Coz]

Thanks stuart. I rely on ball flight ball speed hla etc maybe someday but right now ill just stick to skypro and gc2. I don't have a camera for video either #1 get this back pain to go away! Ive hit 1 too many golf balls it appears. Ughh

Oh I read somewhere the hmt is great at determining your lie angle that's cool. Nice confirmation that your clubs are for right.

[StuartG]

No smart phone that can take videos? It really doesn't take much of a camera to be useful - even an inexpensive point-and-shoot camera can get the job done. Many say you need a high frame rate but that's really not true. It can be nice but it's not a requirement at all. Most people overlook that the main point of the video is to see what the _body_ is doing. and maybe a few key club positions in the back swing. Seeing what the club is doing when it's moving it's fastest is only looking at consequences of any swing flaws, not the cause of them.

Oh, and for checking lie angle, all you really need is just a dry erase marker to get a very accurate assessment.

[Wizard of Coz]

You know what I think I did use my iPad and some app before to video and draw some lines. Man im getting old I forgot all about that. I didn't have a set up that made it easy to do. I propped it up on something to get the video. It was easier working with my skypro, I think that is why I didn't use that but once or twice and eventually forgot about it. Too funny

[AdamV]

Absolutely loving the GCquad with club data, but as others have said, would be less value if you don’t know what to do with the data.

Right now, lie angle (serious toe down on mishits causing blocked irons) has exposed a really bad habit I have with early release. Now I’m working on it, but that hadn’t really come up for a long-time in lessons I’ve had.