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**goatbarn** · 02-10-2017, 11:48 PM

Those are all within a reasonable ballpark for a 7 iron.

**Stueyd123** · 02-11-2017, 12:06 AM

Thanks for that. Do you have any suggestions how to drop the launch angle without getting too steep coming into the ball.

**goatbarn** · 02-11-2017, 12:11 AM

Need less dynamic loft or loft delivered to the ball at impact.

For your ball speed though, I don't think I'd want to launch it lower than 17*. Unless your spin was over 8k.

Lower dynamic loft with more shaft lean, increase spin via steeper aoa...all else equal. Spin is mostly generated by club head speed though. So long as you're not hitting it high on the face.

what ball you using?

**Stueyd123** · 02-11-2017, 12:17 AM

I was using a Callaway chrome soft but usually use prov x. What's the best way to get better shaft lean as I feel that is something I need to improve to get better compression.

**tlhammond5** · 02-11-2017, 12:43 AM

The numbers are a bit off, but it looks to be from too little AOA. Launch a bit high and spin a bit low is normally due to shallow AOA. They aren't way off.

**goatbarn** · 02-11-2017, 12:47 AM

Too many variables to say x gets you more shaft lean. Basically you need to create more space for arms to speed up through impact.

**Dax** · 02-11-2017, 02:53 AM

I thought 6200 was not all that bad. I believe Mark crossfield in his Iblade review was getting similar spin averages with his 7 iron and he seemed pretty happy with how that compared to his Miz blades which averaged about 250 more from what I recall.

Im looking at picking up some iblades for this season and so I have been watching everything out their. Time to retire my i20s and liked what I saw with some hits at the range with the iblade.

**tlhammond5** · 02-11-2017, 03:24 AM

Originally posted by goatbarn View Post

Too many variables to say x gets you more shaft lean. Basically you need to create more space for arms to speed up through impact.

Did I miss something? Are we talking about someone getting trapped?

**tlhammond5** · 02-11-2017, 07:05 AM

Originally posted by Stueyd123 View Post

I was using a Callaway chrome soft but usually use prov x. What's the best way to get better shaft lean as I feel that is something I need to improve to get better compression.

Too many players try to create forward shaft lean by using their hands to manipulate the swing plane. This is not recommended. The best advice I can give you is to work on your setup and takeaway. If you can get the club in a good position at the top, try to feel like you're rotating into impact without using your hands and arms. Your hands and arms will do what they need to do naturally. You hear a lot of guys teaching folks to "set their hands". This is rubbish! There's no such thing. The more you manipulate your hands on the takeaway, the more you have to manipulate your hands on the downswing. Good players hit the ball with their core or torso. So, try to focus on using body mechanics to get the club in the proper impact position. For example... Pros used to teach a toe up club head position halfway back in the takeaway. This requires right hand supination and opening off the club face. Today's top teachers have abandoned this method. They are now teaching no hand and forearm manipulation on the takeaway. This puts the leading edge of the club head around 45° halfway back (which is actually on-plane). In other words, really try to take the club away with your core and torso. Also, keep your hands in front of your sturnum. (If you look at old videos of your pros, you will see that the toe of their club was pointing straight down at the top of their swing. Tour pros today have a more closed clubface at the top). Once you get to the top, focus on a smooth transition using body rotation instead of arms and hands. This will help you to clear your lower body while allowing the arms and hands to lag behind, creating the proper forward shaft lean and impact position you desire.

Sorry, for the long explanation!

**Stueyd123** · 02-11-2017, 08:29 AM

Ok thanks guys. I actually do have a tendency to get my arms dropping too much from the top and hence get the club attacking from the inside too much. ( 6 to 5 deg) I changed my posture slightly so I had slightly more weight towards my toes, took the club straighter back and tried to get my weight more towards my left side at impact. This seemed to help with my launch angle. My bad shot has always been a pull, but I attack from the inside, so my face is obviously not pointing enough right of target at impact. This issue I seem to be having is that although the gc2 and hmt are giving me numbers, it doesn't really explain why it is happening.

**tlhammond5** · 02-11-2017, 09:10 AM

Originally posted by Stueyd123 View Post

Ok thanks guys. I actually do have a tendency to get my arms dropping too much from the top and hence get the club attacking from the inside too much. ( 6 to 5 deg) I changed my posture slightly so I had slightly more weight towards my toes, took the club straighter back and tried to get my weight more towards my left side at impact. This seemed to help with my launch angle. My bad shot has always been a pull, but I attack from the inside, so my face is obviously not pointing enough right of target at impact. This issue I seem to be having is that although the gc2 and hmt are giving me numbers, it doesn't really explain why it is happening.

Oh... I see. Goatbarn had a good point then. It sounds like you might be getting trapped behind your trailing side. This is likely causing you to flip the club with your hands prior to impact. Interesting! This isn't the common flaw. I agree that you should take it away more on plane or over the plane. Taking the club inside on the way back is bad bad news. I know a lot of people think that this helps produce a draw, but it's actually just the opposite. It either causes you to come over the top as you begin your downswing transition or it causes you to get too far behind your trailing side. If you watch your pros swing, you will see that most are above the plane on the takeaway (club head outside of the hands). There are exceptions... Jason Dufner takes the club inside. He also fights coming over the top. The setup and takeaway are the real keys to a good golf swing! Getting the club in the proper position at the top makes transitioning into impact much easier!

**Shankygolf** · 02-11-2017, 11:14 AM

WOW! Always amazes me when reading these kind of posts that conclusions are jumped to so quickly without collecting all of the data!

The OP has HMT so why not ask for the rest of the data before suggesting things that may do more harm than good??

Sounds like Goat and tlhammond have a good enough understanding of things but let's find out what his AoA is, path and face to path relationships, dynamic loft, strike location etc etc and then we might actually be able to offer the guy some more informed advice.

Just my 2p worth as a PGA coach

**tlhammond5** · 02-11-2017, 04:44 PM

Not bad advice Mthunt, but having a PGA club professional card doesn't magically give someone knowledge of the golf swing. I had a card for 17 years myself. I met more PGA card carrying pros who new more about clothing and equipment than the golf swing. The PGA does a great job preparing folks to sell equipment and provide customer service. Most of golf swing stuff is self learned. If you can pass a PAT and read, you can be a PGA professional. Obtaining your card is very time consuming these days though. It's much harder than it once was.

**tlhammond5** · 02-11-2017, 04:57 PM

Originally posted by Shankygolf View Post

WOW! Always amazes me when reading these kind of posts that conclusions are jumped to so quickly without collecting all of the data!

The OP has HMT so why not ask for the rest of the data before suggesting things that may do more harm than good??

Sounds like Goat and tlhammond have a good enough understanding of things but let's find out what his AoA is, path and face to path relationships, dynamic loft, strike location etc etc and then we might actually be able to offer the guy some more informed advice.

Just my 2p worth as a PGA coach

What? The advice I gave works for anyone regardless of AOA or any other swing characteristic. It's basic swing fundamentals, and it's correct swing fundamentals. "PGA Coach"? Is this a self given title? I'm assuming you are a PGA of America card holder. I held a card for 17 years and decided to let it go a couple years back. Holding that card is an honor, but it doesn't automatically insinuate anyone has proper knowledge of the golf swing. Do you know that almost half of the guys the PGA tour players work with don't have and have never had a PGA of America card?

I'm not bashing the PGA of America. It's a phenomenal organization! It gives future and present club pros the tools they need to survive in golf retail.

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