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Improving TGC realism

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  • Improving TGC realism

    HI,

    I recently bought TGC and PG (on the PC) to find out what they are all about and eventually
    pick one for simulation. My main criteria is realism, the closer to "being there" the
    better. Overall I'm liking them both but there are a few things in TGC I think should be
    changed to improve the sense of realism. Of course it is just one persons opinion but (in
    no particular order) they are:


    - Flag Distance Marker icon with large lettering in the center of the screen prior to the
    hit. I've never looked down a fairway and seen *that* in real life! It makes it look
    like a video game. I'd like to see it changed to something more space efficient and also
    moved to an unobtrusive location.

    - Large menus in both corners blocking even more of the golf course. Again, no overlay
    menus in real life so make them much less intrusive.

    - Player perspective camera. One of the joys of golf is to hit a shot and watch it soar
    off into the distance. So far I can't find any camera views replicating that feel. This
    is a *big* disappointment so hopefuly I've just missed it. The players perspective camera
    is the closest I've found but falls well short since the ball disappears from the view on
    most clubs and then later drops out of the sky back into view. Definitely not what I see
    when playing real golf.

    - Related to that, when the "follow cam" takes over the ball position seems completely
    disconnected from it's position earlier in the flight. One shouldn't suddenly have to move
    their eyes to find the ball again when the new camera view takes over. Balls don't really
    jump around like that in real life. I still haven't got used to the short disconnect that
    occurs as I'm hunting for the ball in the new view just prior to landing.

    - YELLOW comet trail. Why is the "comet tail" on a white ball yellow? Accepting that a
    comet tail can actually help with realism (ie its easier to see the ball IRL than on a sim
    screen), is there really any need to make it yellow? Flaming yellow ball trails just make
    it look like a video game. Keep it subtle...make them white (and adjustable in length).

    - Putting grid. The Putting grid can't be easily toggled on/off and seems heavy handed
    anyway. Again, one doesn't see a grid in real life so every effort should go into making
    it as unobtrusive as possible. A more sparse grid, or no grid at all, a break line indicator,
    explicit shading to indicate contours, mowing lines...there are probably lots of smart ideas
    that address the issue with more realism than what exists now.

    - Field of view. The FOV seems excessively narrow/tight. Stand on a tee or fairway in
    real life and compare what you see with what TGC shows. It isn't even remotely close.
    "Suspend disbelief" only goes so far before the illusion collapses.


    I don't know how many of these are unique to the PC game versus the Protee Sim but assume
    unless told otherwise they are the same. In my opinion cleaning these up will improve the
    realism factor and help mature TGC into a real simulator not just a video game.

  • #2
    You need to play the sim version which is different than the pc version. Good points abd suggestions you bring up though.

    Comment


    • #3
      Faulty, another of those "can't please all the people all the time" situations with your observations.

      Hole marker icon - guess you've never been in the bush on TGC. Finding the icon on screen while changing the suggested shot direction is the only way to find out where the green actually is.

      There are no 'large' menus in the corners in the sim version.

      Follow cam - don't see the issue

      Comet trail colour - could be pink for all I care

      Putting grid toggles easily - what's the niggle?

      Field of view complaints - do you have the space for a 3 projector 3 screen surround set-up? You'll get your immersive experience there.

      Sorry for my views but you looked at the PC version and start proposing improvements to something you haven't even seen.
      Last edited by aja; 12-12-2015, 05:46 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        What are the main differences between the PC version and the sim version of TGC? I've only been able to play the PC version so far.

        Comment


        • #5
          I think the op is better looking for a Star Trek Holodeck type sim. Imagine trying to read distances and elevevelations and undulations on a 2D rendering on a screen? Boy. That would be fun.
          My Courses:
          World Par 3's by mthunt
          Toronto GC (L) mthunt
          Burlington G&CC by mthunt
          Weston G&CC by mthunt
          London Hunt Club L mthunt
          Park CC Lidar mthunt
          Sunningdale GC Robinson L
          Sunningdale GC Thompson L
          Muirfield Village (liDAR) First Ever Lidar course
          Country Club of Castle Pines (liDAR)
          The Sanctuary GC ProTee L
          The National GC L mthunt
          Mississaugua GC L mthunt
          Shaughnessy G&CC L mthunt
          Markland Woods CC mthunt
          Hidden Lake Old L mthunt
          Magna GC L mthunt
          Barrie CC L mthunt
          mthunt Range

          Comment


          • #6
            It's not about the capriciousness of trying to please all the people all the time, nor wishing for Star Trek holodecks...it's about the fundamental, core driving philosophy of the game designers. Are they trying to make the most accurate, realistic simulation possible or are they making a nice golf video game.

            It's clear from playing the PC versions that HB is in the latter camp (as is anyone happy with pink comet trails and Star Trek Holodecks).

            People often wonder about the difference between PG and TGC. Of course there are many, but certainly this appears to be one.

            The big question is what is the fundamental, driving philosophy for the Protee Sim. If it includes accurate, realistic simulation then they have work to do fixing their supplier's game. They are certainly capable but I don't know if they care that much either. I can't tell since there is no demo available. The best I could do was look at the PC version. If it isn't a fair representation of the Protee Sim then Protee probably needs to do something about that (ie get a proper playable demo out).

            It should be clear from my post that I'm firmly in the camp of accurate, faithful reproduction in simulation. I didn't spend all this money to play video games. In the end I will pick PG versus TGC based on which one implements that philosophy the best (of course $$ may be a factor too). People with different goals may decide differently. Right now, I'm still trying to figure out where Protee fits in all this. SDL asked a good question above.

            Comment


            • aja
              aja commented
              Editing a comment
              HB studios are console game designers. More likely than not that is 'the fundamental, core driving philosophy of the game designers' - to make a killer console game. I think that shouldn't surprise anyone. TGC for sim use is being evolved from a console game. Dennis from ProTee saw an opportunity and as they say 'ran with it'. TGC for sim use has been available for over a year and is constantly being improved and being made better for use as a golf sim.

              I can't agree with your belief that there is work to do to 'fix' TGC to get 'accurate, realistic simulation'. It is there today and it has been there from the beginning.

              PG is in beta, has been talked about for some time and isn't exactly being rushed to market. From what I've seen in some of the videos it is a very realistic appearing game/sim, no question about that. It may very well be the best choice for you and many others. But I think you are alluding to shortcomings in TGC which just aren't there.

              Those of us playing TGC have already voted with our wallets.
              Last edited by aja; 12-13-2015, 10:15 AM.

          • #7
            The sim version is geared toward simulation. that would include the look of the ball starting point, flight algorithm, gound physics roll etc, shortcut menue's, game penalties (bunker, rough etc) etc etc. I cant list all the differences but they are there. A demo option should be coming in the new year. There are certain things that Protee get from HB that is unique to the sim version with each update. Autorewind is an example. Coming soon will be game stats on the range. I hope you get a chance to try the sim version at some point.
            Last edited by Bubba22; 12-12-2015, 10:15 PM.

            Comment


            • FaultyClubs
              FaultyClubs commented
              Editing a comment
              Great news about the demo option! I'll be looking forward to it.

              Realistic simulation includes more than ball related physics though...the human interface is always a big part of any real simulator.

            • Bubba22
              Bubba22 commented
              Editing a comment
              I agree Faulty but like I always say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Hopefully a demo version will happen soon.
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