How long will you wait??

[wbond]

Really just kind of a poll for those of you that STILL have a skytrak.

Are you considering getting rid of your skytrak? If so, under what conditions?
1-Less than 3 months (i.e., already looking for another device/waiting for ES16 reviews) Votes 9, 32%
2-Within the year (it's going to get you through the current offseason, but plan to bail after) Votes 11, 39%
3-Never, your happy with it as is. Votes 7, 25%
4-Your not happy but keeping it because you are not willing to pay more for something else. Votes 1, 4%

When I pre-ordered my skytrak, I was very happy because i knew what it was capable of, I knew what hardware was required, I knew what I wanted the unit for and I was content with the other sim options I had at the time (opti and p3). However, after using the skytrak and seeing just how off the other two systems could be at times, i am really now wanting a ball tracking system with true sim play and have gotten really tired of the waiting game. Especially since others have said that TGC is ready to go. FWIW, i believe the one I have is accurate and I am satisfied with the performance. I thought I would be satisfied with just an accurate device with a range, but after having it for some time, I'm really wanting sim play.

So I'm the option 2 crowd or 1 if i could find a good deal on another device.

[Mazenblue]

I'm a 1 or 2. It's fine for range practice and pretty accurate, It's the sync and customer support I have an issue with. I know, broken record.

[dover]

1 or 2 for me as well. I was another early adopter and bought for use in Vietnam. Had to buy everything including all the hardware for the sim setup from the US so shipping and import taxes were massive. Was hoping that the sim software would have been mid 2015 as promised. Now its 2016 and the 2 cold/wet months here and cannot utilize the Skytrak as hoped. With the amount I have spent already on the room setup the extra cost for a proper integrated sim launch monitor (if the ES16 is that) would result in me changing.
It is amazing with all this that Seth has not said anything. Surely with a majority of customers being upset at the customer service they would be doing all in their power to try and placate people.

[wbond]

UPDATED TOTALS
Option 1 Leaving asap Votes 9, 32%
Option 2 Leaving within year Votes 11, 39%
Option 3 Happy as is Votes 7, 25%
Option 4 Not happy but stuck Votes 1, 4%

[liturbo]

I had a horrible experience with the 1st ST unit that I purchased. After trying every conceivable fix including leveling, making sure the ST was free from vibration, placement of ball on red dot/behind red dot, lighting, resetting the unit 20 plus times reloading the app, etc., etc., etc., I finally demanded a new ST which I received without too much trouble. My second ST has been close to flawless and based on real world testing at the range it has been incredibly accurate as to all distances and shot shape- I actually hit a hybrid that sliced right--the ball hit a 220 yard marker at the range that was about 20 yards to the right of my launch and the ST was dead on showing a 221 yard carry/21 yards right-- with a shot shape exactly what my eye detected. I would be lying if I said I haven't enjoyed WGT and the E6 demo but based on the supposed imminent release of TGC for ST I went out and purchased a new gaming computer, a projector and all of the Sim components necessary to play TGC (or possibly PG). After all the false starts and promises and no release in sight, not to mention the multi-thousand dollar additional investment, I am frustrated. I too am waiting to see how the ES16 works out--if it is possible to get a working TGC sim with an accurate LM I will seriously jump ship if I can play some sim golf during the remaining winter months.

[SkyTrak_Seth]

It is amazing with all this that Seth has not said anything. Surely with a majority of customers being upset at the customer service they would be doing all in their power to try and placate people.

I'm just now getting back into the forum, but certainly not a great thread to come back to. I've been trying to help in specific threads...not sure what you want me to say here.

[Shardak]

For me, I bought skytrak and skypro to improve my game. Sim golf was not an option when i purchased it (sept 2015), so the "coming soon" has not yet become as annoying as you guys that have been hearing it for longer.

Skytrak has helped me improve my ball striking a significant amount, in just 3 months. I can, for the first time in my life, hit draws/fades, with pretty good accuracy. I know my club distances to a pretty accurate range. I can change lofts on my driver and see the differences in shot shape and distance. I can try new clubs and see how they fit into my game. I took my 3-iron out of my bag and replaced it with a Titleist H2 hybrid after seeing that I hit the same distance with both, but was much more accurate with the hybrid. Its allowing me to improve my game at a pace that far exceeds paying someone $100/hour for lessons.

I find sim golf a much better way to practice than just banging 100 shots on the range (where you fine tune between shots and get un-realisticly accurate grooves going). Playing real or sim golf, you get one try at each shot, and your swing issues and nerves come into play. So I do hope that sim options are released "soon". If perfect golf comes out at $250/year, I will be signing up day 1.

I feel like I got my moneys worth with with Skytrak. I am a software developer at a small company myself. We have some big clients. I can sympathize with your guys anger, but I also understand where sport trak is coming from. Developing software is hard, hitting timelines is hard, especially when external factors and 3rd parties come into play. They have done a terrible job setting expectations, but the product they have released so far is solid, polished and does what its supposed to do (a few bugs aside).

I hope you guys that are fuming over this, and threatening lawsuits (come on man....), are not letting this anger affect your games! Go hit a few balls, drink a few beers, and enjoy what Skytrak has delivered.

I will be keeping my skytrak for the forseeable future. Even if ES16 is $2500, and is more accurate, I wont jump ship now. I think Skytrak is good for me for 3-5 years, at which point maybe Skytrak 2 will be out, or something else that is a big leap in performance / accuracy etc, and cheaper.

Hit em straight gentlemen ;-)

[dover]

I'm just now getting back into the forum, but certainly not a great thread to come back to. I've been trying to help in specific threads...not sure what you want me to say here.

Hi Seth

The major issues I can see most people having ongoing issues with and the reasons that the reputation of Skytrak is being smashed are, in no particular order
- The $99 fee for GIP which most people when buying paid as a one-off payment then were told later it is a yearly fee. This is a questionable business practice at best.
- Sync issues. Many people are having sync issues. I need to log into E6 first to make the Skytrak app sync with the machine. Others have issues with all the stats etc not being recorded
- Battery life. A lot of people are only getting 3 hours battery life, not 5+
- Delays. With everything. Skytrak sells itself as a golf simulator however as yet there is still no simulation available. Issues that people are having with the system do not seem to get fixed in a timely manner.
- Lack of customer service. The only replies or updates we get are from you on here. For a $2000 product customer service needs to be a priority.
- Poor implementation of WGT. For $200 per year, the software should be fully functional and any issues quickly repaired.

The above I think are the major issues people have. Generally it is people feel that they have not gotten what they paid for, in respect to a yearly fee for something that was supposedly a once off, a launch monitor instead of a simulator, poor customer service etc. As I am Asian based I could have purchased the Japanese version, however purchased the US version at a slight premium as I thought the end product and service would be superior for a native English speaker. The hardware itself seems to be a great price point and a functional device, as the Japanese version works without as many issues. It seems the problems most people have are from the decisions made by Skygolf/Sportrak and the delays from that side.

I would recommend that Skytrak get on the front foot and try and resolve users issues and give accurate (as possible) information as to when things will be released, update as to bug repair etc. Other issues such as the ongoing yearly $99 payment need to be resolved for those that purchased this expecting a one off payment.

I do think this is a good product but has been poorly implemented into the market. I feel sorry for you personally as I am sure you are making an effort to resolve what you can, but I think a team effort is required to ensure users of this product are happy with it and feel like they are being treated as valued customers, not money pits.

Regards
Dover

[SkyTrak_Seth]

Thank you for the very well-written and constructive post. I agree with you on all fronts. I can tell you that I personally have very little control over the majority of those issues, with the exception of a 50% stake in the data sync problem. But I can certainly circulate these concerns and try to improve the process all around. I truly believe that 2016 will be a fantastic year. Thank you for hanging in there.

[DougieMn]

Hi Seth

The major issues I can see most people having ongoing issues with and the reasons that the reputation of Skytrak is being smashed are, in no particular order
- The $99 fee for GIP which most people when buying paid as a one-off payment then were told later it is a yearly fee. This is a questionable business practice at best.
- Sync issues. Many people are having sync issues. I need to log into E6 first to make the Skytrak app sync with the machine. Others have issues with all the stats etc not being recorded
- Battery life. A lot of people are only getting 3 hours battery life, not 5+
- Delays. With everything. Skytrak sells itself as a golf simulator however as yet there is still no simulation available. Issues that people are having with the system do not seem to get fixed in a timely manner.
- Lack of customer service. The only replies or updates we get are from you on here. For a $2000 product customer service needs to be a priority.
- Poor implementation of WGT. For $200 per year, the software should be fully functional and any issues quickly repaired.

The above I think are the major issues people have. Generally it is people feel that they have not gotten what they paid for, in respect to a yearly fee for something that was supposedly a once off, a launch monitor instead of a simulator, poor customer service etc. As I am Asian based I could have purchased the Japanese version, however purchased the US version at a slight premium as I thought the end product and service would be superior for a native English speaker. The hardware itself seems to be a great price point and a functional device, as the Japanese version works without as many issues. It seems the problems most people have are from the decisions made by Skygolf/Sportrak and the delays from that side.

I would recommend that Skytrak get on the front foot and try and resolve users issues and give accurate (as possible) information as to when things will be released, update as to bug repair etc. Other issues such as the ongoing yearly $99 payment need to be resolved for those that purchased this expecting a one off payment.

I do think this is a good product but has been poorly implemented into the market. I feel sorry for you personally as I am sure you are making an effort to resolve what you can, but I think a team effort is required to ensure users of this product are happy with it and feel like they are being treated as valued customers, not money pits.

Regards
Dover

Well said Dover!

I think you pretty much hit all the points. All of these issues make the upcoming PGA show that much more exciting, only wish I were attending. It will be VERY interesting to see what has been resolved with SkyTrak as well as see what the competition looks like and what our options will be going forward.

I'm not opposed to jumping ship but hope it doesn't come to that.

[doublebogey]

Very well-written letter to Seth (and hopefully gets passed on to the higher-ups at SkyGolf) Dover - sincere and constructively critical in all the right ways.

I think biggest issue really is "people feel that they have not gotten what they paid for."

Generally it is people feel that they have not gotten what they paid for, in respect to a yearly fee for something that was supposedly a once off, a launch monitor instead of a simulator, poor customer service etc.

As you can see, people have not really complained about shelling out $2k for the device (other than the lack of customer support that goes with a $2k product). People complain about shelling out $100/year for a still very buggy and looks unfinished GIP. People complain about shelling out $200/year for a WGT that still has bugs that have been mentioned many times and no one seems to care to fix. People are all ready to shell out $1k for TGC so money is not their complaint about sim - just the lack of it and the delays.

Then they turn around and see guys playing PG beta on their GC2's that's better than anything SkyTrak has to offer for $100-200/year for a mere $20. Most agree the free E6 demo is better than anything SkyTrak has to offer for $100-200/year. When people were able to use GIP free, nobody really complained about it much but simply offered suggestions for improvements. WGT's free challenge demo was met w great fanfare and not much complaints either. What this really shows is what SkyTrak currently offers at $100-200/year are really still beta/demo products that should be offered to customers for free (for now) and there will be no more complaints. If you're gonna charge $100/year then the sync must work effortlessly, there should never be any need to uninstall and reinstall app, battery meter should function properly and SkyGolf 360 server should work faster to avoid any delays in syncing and therefore performance on the front-end. If you're gonna charge $200/year, then the auto-putt bug has gotta be fixed ASAP, multi-player feature must be looked into and implemented, and shot angles improved ASAP.

Give you another example, I recently used a GC2 at my fitter while getting fit for a new driver. It was an eye opener as it just works and really is truly far more superior than SkyTrak (and the superiority really is in every way other than the accuracy btw and I'll explain why later). I brought my own ST to the fitter to put next to the GC2 and was gonna hit w all 3 (ST, GC2 and a Flightscope behind me). But it took me so long to try to set up ST and couldn't get shot to register on it (not sure if it was leveling, lighting or what) so I just gave up. On the other hand, the GC2 was like place it down, put ball anywhere and just hit. Now why do I say GC2 is superior than ST in every way other than the accuracy? Because I do believe ST is accurate enough (except for some of the defective units), though less accurate than GC2, but at less than 1/3 the price I'll take the ST. But everything else (including portability and using outdoors) GC2 trumps ST - the GC2 simply just works (maybe GC2's marketing slogan should be "It just works!"

Seth, you should also really pass the forum's survey on ST and GC2 to the higher-ups at SkyGolf as it is very telling (survery for ST http://golfsimulatorforum.com/review/skytrak and survey for GC2 http://golfsimulatorforum.com/review/gc2). ST is a 6.5 vs a 9.0 for GC2. Besides the obviously and deservedly low support score for ST, the item that caught my eye was the value for money: 7.7 for GC2 vs 7.0 for ST even though ST cost less than 1/3 of GC2 (though prob skewed coz most of people surveyed here probably bought the GC2 used and that seems like a good value vs ST - see this thread about used GC2 for EUR 2,700 vs. EUR 2,350 for new ST http://golfsimulatorforum.com/forum/...d-gc2-should-i). But it seems like people who have bought GC2s have zero regrets or complaints and that it's worth every cent they paid for it (other than the guilt that their wallet is a little bit thinner than they would like). As for ST, although people generally think they got a good LM at a good price, yet they are potentially regretting about their decision to have purchased the ST, have tons of complaints about it and potentially think they're not getting enough value for the 1/3 the price of GC2 they've spent.

So in summary, SkyTrak really needs to get the main issues Dover mentioned resolved ASAP to make SkyTrak to simply just works so Foresight cannot use the slogan "It just works!" =)

[luv2golf]

Very well-written letter to Seth (and hopefully gets passed on to the higher-ups at SkyGolf) Dover - sincere and constructively critical in all the right ways.

I think biggest issue really is "people feel that they have not gotten what they paid for."



As you can see, people have not really complained about shelling out $2k for the device (other than the lack of customer support that goes with a $2k product). People complain about shelling out $100/year for a still very buggy and looks unfinished GIP. People complain about shelling out $200/year for a WGT that still has bugs that have been mentioned many times and no one seems to care to fix. People are all ready to shell out $1k for TGC so money is not their complaint about sim - just the lack of it and the delays.

Then they turn around and see guys playing PG beta on their GC2's that's better than anything SkyTrak has to offer for $100-200/year for a mere $20. Most agree the free E6 demo is better than anything SkyTrak has to offer for $100-200/year. When people were able to use GIP free, nobody really complained about it much but simply offered suggestions for improvements. WGT's free challenge demo was met w great fanfare and not much complaints either. What this really shows is what SkyTrak currently offers at $100-200/year are really still beta/demo products that should be offered to customers for free (for now) and there will be no more complaints. If you're gonna charge $100/year then the sync must work effortlessly, there should never be any need to uninstall and reinstall app, battery meter should function properly and SkyGolf 360 server should work faster to avoid any delays in syncing and therefore performance on the front-end. If you're gonna charge $200/year, then the auto-putt bug has gotta be fixed ASAP, multi-player feature must be looked into and implemented, and shot angles improved ASAP.

Give you another example, I recently used a GC2 at my fitter while getting fit for a new driver. It was an eye opener as it just works and really is truly far more superior than SkyTrak (and the superiority really is in every way other than the accuracy btw and I'll explain why later). I brought my own ST to the fitter to put next to the GC2 and was gonna hit w all 3 (ST, GC2 and a Flightscope behind me). But it took me so long to try to set up ST and couldn't get shot to register on it (not sure if it was leveling, lighting or what) so I just gave up. On the other hand, the GC2 was like place it down, put ball anywhere and just hit. Now why do I say GC2 is superior than ST in every way other than the accuracy? Because I do believe ST is accurate enough (except for some of the defective units), though less accurate than GC2, but at less than 1/3 the price I'll take the ST. But everything else (including portability and using outdoors) GC2 trumps ST - the GC2 simply just works (maybe GC2's marketing slogan should be "It just works!"

Seth, you should also really pass the forum's survey on ST and GC2 to the higher-ups at SkyGolf as it is very telling (survery for ST http://golfsimulatorforum.com/review/skytrak and survey for GC2 http://golfsimulatorforum.com/review/gc2). ST is a 6.5 vs a 9.0 for GC2. Besides the obviously and deservedly low support score for ST, the item that caught my eye was the value for money: 7.7 for GC2 vs 7.0 for ST even though ST cost less than 1/3 of GC2 (though prob skewed coz most of people surveyed here probably bought the GC2 used and that seems like a good value vs ST - see this thread about used GC2 for EUR 2,700 vs. EUR 2,350 for new ST http://golfsimulatorforum.com/forum/...d-gc2-should-i). But it seems like people who have bought GC2s have zero regrets or complaints and that it's worth every cent they paid for it (other than the guilt that their wallet is a little bit thinner than they would like). As for ST, although people generally think they got a good LM at a good price, yet they are potentially regretting about their decision to have purchased the ST, have tons of complaints about it and potentially think they're not getting enough value for the 1/3 the price of GC2 they've spent.

So in summary, SkyTrak really needs to get the main issues Dover mentioned resolved ASAP to make SkyTrak to simply just works so Foresight cannot use the slogan "It just works!" =)

Maybe because I am more vocal and out spoken, but the last three posts are exactly what I've been saying for 4 months since I found out the whole.....coming soon, was complete BS.

Thank You for all those how are becoming more outspoken. I think it's funny that skygolf can have 3 hitting bays at the pga show, but can't train for more customer service reps. Or better yet, waive the ridiculous $99/year fee. I bet it's at least $10,000 for that space at the show. Guarantee there aren't 10,000 skytrak users. I'm not a math major, but something seems askew with the numbers and where moneys being spent........(again, these are my personal opinions, numbers may vary and costs are speculative and unconfirmed).

[bennyg211]

I've dealt with their customer support a number of times. It's more difficult for me than you being UK based, so I cannot access the people with the knowhow you can, only the UK office, which do not know that much about the product (this may have changed since the official release here in November though and they will have had product training i'm guessing). I can only live chat with the US since i'm too tight to pay for an international phone call. I have found the support, whichever route, to be quick to respond. The problem they have is not enough software engineers and not support. Support can only be great if they can deliver the solutions. So, lets have 50 more customer support so they can answer the phone, email or live chat in under one minute as opposed to under 5. It won't help they will just log the same half dozen or so issues outlined in @Dovers email a little tiny bit quicker. If you had to wait 30 mins or more to speak to someone then I would agree that more support resource is needed.

On why would they up the support? Lets see, if a company doesn't advertise or promote the product then people won't know that it either exists, what it does, how much it costs, if its better than wants out there, what colour it is, can I have Elsa and Anna emblazoned on it and most importantly how much it costs. So, if they are not allowed to advertise because they can't possibly have three driving bays then how would they expect to sell units? If a company is not selling anymore units then where would they possibly get the revenue stream to pay for more engineers as it would be attractive to with a growing user base and there would be mileage in enhancements? If my technology history is correct then beta was definitely the better system than VHS for a number of reasons. Betamax died and VHS prevailed because more people adopted VHS. Now I wonder why more people bought VHS, it might've been to do a little bit with the advertising strategy.

Not sure what i've not got with your comments, so i'm asking what i've not gotten, per your request.

Not sure the relevance of my business CV is to the conversation, I was pretty good at French oral but not the written exam, and I think generally i before e, except after c.

I can't be bothered to capitalise certain letters or phrases in case you miss the huge and wide ranging ramifications of the points i've made, so just imagine some of the above words are in capital at whatever point you see fit. (i'm just joking, keeping it light X)

[TorchRedRob]

Always a real treat when luv joins the conversation.

[luv2golf]

Thank you........lots of love from luv.

[Ookie]

Option (-1): I pulled the ejector seat handle roughly a month ago.

Three reasons why...

1. The writing was on the wall with the business ethics of the company;
2. It was the peak of holiday shopping season; and
3. The launch of ES-16 was a month away.

#s 2 and 3 put a hard deck date in my head. The unit needed to be to its new home before Christmas. I did very well on the sale.

Those of you who want to get out who still hold on are taking a huge gamble here. If ES-16 ends up working properly and being reasonably priced, there are going to be a flood of used Skytraks on the secondary market. Get out while you can!

[bennyg211]

Not sure what you mean by a huge gamble? It still is an accurate LM and the sim will likely come out at some point after the PGA show, if not before. The fact that ES16 will come out won't change what the Skytrak unit is, in as much as it won't change what the GC2 is? These things will all coexist in a market space that is, as of yet, uncluttered since they all target different price points. I can't see how all this talk of ES16 has much bearing on Skytrak, barring the people that have some extra dollars/pounds that they can plump at the higher price. But most of these people are already in the Skytrak/GC2 limbo.

Next year there'll be talk of another unit and suddenly people will be speculating that the ES16 will be a dud unit. It is clear that all of these soothsayers are people that have recently sold on their Skytrak and have invest in a GC2 or are waiting for the ES16. To these people I wish you the best of luck, and the reasons you had for ditching the Skytrak were real and accurate to you and you made the right decision based on your circumstances and feelings. However, don't act as soothsayers with some sort of mystic knowledge of the market place to current owners. Most current Skytrak owners, if not all of us, are intelligent enough to make our own decision based on the same criteria you have. Talk of ethics on Sktrak's part is a two way street - lauding that the writing is on the wall for a company's product based on personal opinion could also be seen to be unethical and could be a self-fulfilling prophecy if it potentially affects sales of the Skytrak unit to new owners and therefore it becomes a product hard to support if there is no new revenue.

Please don't think that i'm specifically having a go at you Ookie because I really am not, this is a similar post to quite a few and one I have had a bit of time to formulate a response to. Everyone on here is aware of the people that have decided to ditch and switch and the reasons as to why. I am having sync issues, like many others. It's not life threatening and it will get fixed in time and at that point I would expect Skytrak to make amends with respect to GIP, as Seth has mentioned he will see people are looked after. We haven't got sim golf yet, nor did I have sim golf 2 years ago, nothing has changed other that I am aware that it will be available at some point.

Best of luck with the ES16, I hope that it has a mega launch and is everything that early information and speculation suggest it might be.

[Ookie]

I should have been clearer in the fact that I am referring to people who have decided that they ARE going to get out. If you have decided to stick with it, it's not going to be an issue. But as you can see from the results of this poll, a substantial number of owners are planning to get out.

SMH at you stating that saying that the writing is on the wall with regard to this product could be unethical.

While the poll on this page is unscientific, 70% of current owners are considering getting out within a year. Think about that for a second. Over 2/3s of the sample here are so dissatisfied that they are thinking of selling and trading up. That's pretty substantial.

If sales did plummet due to what we are writing about the product here, who do you think would be responsible? Us, or the company that sold us a package with no time limitation on our receipts and then decided that it was only good for a year, charged cards at the time of preorders (instead of at time of shipping as it industry standard), etc?

I have also had the sync issues, and none of us have been happy with the delays on sim. I wouldn't have a huge issue if it was just this stuff. Problems are to be expected with any new software. The other stuff is just plain garbage--and they have had plenty of time to make amends.

[SDL]

I can understand the reasons some people have jumped ship on the ST and shifted their passion for sim golf onto the proven qualities of the GC2 or the hoped for qualities of the ES16. I wish the ST had a real sim option for little or no additional cost. I wish the ST software issues could be fixed more quickly and with more consistent customer support. I hate the idea of a subscription model for sim software or the alternative of paying $1000 or more for software that is comparable to a $20-30 PC game, but that seems to be the reality in the golf sim world. Despite these problems, I still think that the ST is a great value in a launch monitor (in a business where there are very few great values), and owners who bought the ST only as a launch monitor are generally happy with it because they had realistic expectations when they bought it. In the words of the golf shop owner who sold me my ST: "Why would I spend $8000 on another GC2 when I can get the same data from a SkyTrak for $2000?" And I agree! I knew from the start that the GC2 was a proven unit and the ST was only gradually getting its act together, but the ST does give me the data I want with decent accuracy. And I didn't have to take a chance on a used GC2 or pay $6-10k to get ball flight data from a new launch monitor.

I really think that there is insufficient appreciation for a successful business model in the golf sim world. Few of the posters on this forum have purchased the GC2 at full price along with the software from the company. This means that Foresight has made zero dollars from the GC2 users who buy used units and then play TGC or PG on them. Foresight seems to recognize this and has threatened to figure out how to secure the data output from the GC2, but they haven't actually accomplished this yet. In contrast, ST folks have realized that they can't stay in business only by selling hardware because software is a big part of the business. (This is basically what Bill Gates taught IBM when Microsoft was just getting started.) So ST has to either try to develop its own sim software to compete with TGC or E6 or PG, or it has to set up a way to get some steady income from other developers' software that is used on the ST. This is why the software lease issues have become such a big deal. And it's not just a ST issue. Take a look at the complaints on the Perfect Golf forum about PG's subscription plans when a full-cost version is finally released for the PC.

For me the bottom line is that ST is a great value in a launch monitor and has the potential to be more. I'm still hoping it will be able to reach its potential.

[coz]

Camp 3.
I was looking to improve my ball striking over the winter and I believe it has already done that. We will see if my GIR increase this next year. After I hit a shot, I can pretty much guess the carry yardage and spin .Ive definitely learned in an efficient way with the unit. I enjoy WGT unlike most posters especially working on my irons with the challenges. WGT rounds I just accept the 1, 2 or 3 putt. Im not using it to improve my putting so it doesn't bother me that putting isn't useful. Every practice session starts with wedges dropping them on 25,40,50,60,70,84 and 97 yards. I couldn't have done that prior to using it. The outdoor range I use doesn't have useful targets inside 90 yard. The skytrak seems very reliable and consistent. As for the red laser dot, I like it. I know exactly where im placing the ball and to me that just takes one more variable out of the equation making it more accurate. Ive hit on the GC2 and like it although it should have a laser dot IMO. I have a tv on the wall to view the shots. I recover my ball and then look at the tv for the shot so I don't notice the delay like someone would if they had sim set up with projector. Therefore the delay isn't bothersome for me. I may change my mind in the future but I doubt it. Ive been using the unit for 2 months. 3 more months and hopefully ill be playing outdoors and hopefully see game improvement. Michigan winters

[wbond]

im with you, mi winters suck, but we've been very lucky so far this winter, warmest December ever. It was great yesterday as well, but of course it came to an end this morning.

[Mazenblue]

I miss the Michigan winters and the pot holes...55 here in Nevada. I will wear a long sleeve shirt tomorrow. Before any name calling starts, we must stay on topic!

[BogeyMan]

Since I have owned mine less than 3 months I will say I am in camp 1. Not really pleased with the results of Skytrak so far. Ball flight calculations off, super slow to get PC integration, even slow for sim integration. I will be evaluating competing products as they come out and competitive price points and will sell if I believe there is a better product introduced with better support.

[DougieMn]

Thank you for the very well-written and constructive post. I agree with you on all fronts. I can tell you that I personally have very little control over the majority of those issues, with the exception of a 50% stake in the data sync problem. But I can certainly circulate these concerns and try to improve the process all around. I truly believe that 2016 will be a fantastic year. Thank you for hanging in there.

So that leads to the obvious question and one in which I believe a lot of us have frustrations over: Who is in control of these issues? Why haven't we heard anything from them?

I'll refrain from a rant because it's useless but I'm with the 70%-ready for the ejector seat even at a steep loss.