Announcement

Collapse

TGC Tour - Congratulations!

Congrats to @Michael Stuewe winning the TGC 2017/2018 Winter Tour - Tournament of Champions !

Join this weeks TGC 2017/2018 Winter Tour - Sony Open with 2 rounds at The Baltasar Springfield NJ - 6662y : https://golfsimulatorforum.com/forum...tour-sony-open
See more
See less

Trackman 4

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Trackman 4

    Does anyone have any experience with the indoor version of this. I would be interested to hear from anyone that uses this. Especially with putting and the use of the metallic sticker on the ball.
    GC2 Eastern Time Zone, USA

  • #2
    Yes, I have a TM 4 and use it with e6 and the putting is excellent now. You hit full shots with a ball with one dot and you putt with a yellow ball for maximum accuracy, it seems to work for me.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by clubchampx9
      Yes, I have a TM 4 and use it with e6 and the putting is excellent now. You hit full shots with a ball with one dot and you putt with a yellow ball for maximum accuracy, it seems to work for me.
      Why a yellow ball?im glad it's working. What distance are you setup with? How many feet from simulator to hitting area


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      GC2 Eastern Time Zone, USA

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by bubs3141

        Why a yellow ball?im glad it's working. What distance are you setup with? How many feet from simulator to hitting area


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
        I'm 10' 11" from screen to tee and 8' 10" from tee to TM. Kevin Noble of TM suggested the yellow ball, not sure why. 10' putts or less can be hit or miss depending on how much uphill or down hill e6 is showing. Downhill works well uphill usually not. I recommend setting e6 to 10' gimmies when playing a round. I only experienced 2 untracked putts for the round. The overall accuracy, left and right is also very good.


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks


          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
          GC2 Eastern Time Zone, USA

          Comment


          • #6
            I'm hearing from some that TM4 is not accurate unless you have at least 13 feet to the screen. Is there any validity to that? I only have 10 feet, but this is the system I want.

            Comment


            • #7
              What is the $2000 annual service fee for? Is there a way of getting out of this?

              Comment


              • #8
                I have been reading through a lot of things written on TM over the past few weeks and was surprised at some of the things that I read. In response to some of the questions above, there is an annual fee with TM and when you buy the first years fees are covered. $1k is for the hardware and the other is for listening and allows you to get continuous updates. Neither of these are mandatory and you can still use the unit without paying these annual amounts.

                The more distance the better. The primary reason for stating a minimum of ten feet is to ensure the unit picks up accurate spin measurements. Ball spin is not estimated as someone posted recently in another thread. You have to put a metal dot on the ball for TM to get the spin numbers in the short distance that it can track the ball. I have between 11 and 12 feet tee to screen and for my swing speed with a driver it is enough to pick up almost all of my shots (sometimes I don't get a reading as I am still trying to find the perfect tee to use. The one I use now still seems to cause the very rare none read when it goes flying. The higher the ball speed and the lower the spin rate is what will require one to have more distance to the screen. There is a good chart on the TM site that can be used to help with this decision.

                Another thing i read somewhere was that club speed is measured after impact and I am not sure where that came from as the unit tracks the club throughout the swing and don't know why one would star this especially when TM defines club speed to be the speed of the club immediately prior to impact.

                One thing that i cant believe is that after all these years there has yet to be a head to head comparison between TM indoors and another launch monitor. I find this very strange indeed and has me thinking that I might pick up a used CG2 when they start becoming available to do some testing. This will also hopefully allow me to start playing TGC online, which is something that has intrigued me for sometime as it sounds like others are having a lot of fun.

                What tests i have seem using using the TM indoors is that when TM does it's testing it appeared they were using very expensive cameras to validate the results that the unit was reporting. I also recall watching a video that I believe was from Japan where the creators of skytrack I believe were validating their monitors results with what a TM was reporting.

                Not specific to TM, but do recall also reading somewhere that someone used flightscope indoors and noted how inaccurate it was, but also noted that no metallic sticker was put on the ball. I can see why they would say the results were poor as they used the unit indoors and missed having one of the key things required to get accurate results.

                While i have not checked this in a while, I do believe that spin axis still gets calculated due to the short distances. I suspect the calculations with TM4 would be pretty good given the more accurate data that it captures for the computations. Again something that needs to be tested.

                Another thing that i have read is with setting up and aligning TM. What I can say is that set-up is very simple you ensure that the unit is at the same height as your hitting area and then you set the distance from tee to screen and from the camera point to your target (I usually put something on the floor in front of the screen that gives me a visual on my line when hitting). This literally takes 30 seconds to do if you had to set up the unit before your session). Once this is done, then you are good to start hitting shots.

                Comment


                • LEO MODE
                  LEO MODE commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I just noticed from other person validating with Trackman website that Spin Axis is always calculated indoor, which shocked me and is a big disappointment if it is true. Because, Spin Axis is never italicized but Ball Spin sometimes is, especially on a driver shot.

                  So I will ask Trackman to see if this is true, because if Spin Axis is always calculated, then a) the number has to italicize to properly inform customers, and b) there needs to be a clarification on how to eliminate the calculation.

                  I am currently comparing both GC2 and Trackman 4 both indoor and outdoor. Although Trackman was consistent both indoor and outdoor, GC2 numbers were all very very close except Spin Axis (or Sidespin) both indoor and outdoor, by having a draw/hook biased result than Trackman.

                  If this GC2 is faulty and indeed Spin Axis is fixed or shows the right number in other GC2, then I think indoor GC2 could be a better solution because all other numbers were extremely close to Trackman both indoor and outdoor. And ball spin you will always get an accurate data indoor with GC2. So in other words GC2 could be the better solution at a cheaper price.
                  Last edited by LEO MODE; Yesterday, 01:31 AM.

                • LEO MODE
                  LEO MODE commented
                  Editing a comment
                  https://blog.trackmangolf.com/spin-axis/

                  Indoor vs Outdoor Mode
                  Note: When using TrackMan in “outdoor” mode, the first ~30 yards of ball flight are used to determine the spin axis value. However, since the spin axis does not change during the ball flight, this measurement is considered to be made after separation from the club face.

                  When using TrackMan in “indoor” mode, the club delivery measurements (spin loft and face to path) are used to calculate the spin axis.

                • Dax
                  Dax commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Leo, this is what I have always understood to be the case.

              • #9
                I received a very informative email from TM today that I believe goes a long way in answering many questions that some users of the GCQ raised during their head to head comparisons. Might be a good read for many and suspect the tech stories will help answer many questions.
                EVER WANTED TO KNOW HOW TRACKMAN ACTUALLY WORKS?


                TrackMan has always been very open about how radar technology works - what the benefits and limitations are. In this age of information its really easy to get lost in between what is actually true and some of the misinterpretations that get put forth as fact.

                In true TrackMan style our development team has release a series of 5 Tech Stories that explain in detail how TrackMan is able to 'see' what it sees. Answering several common questions like:

                How can TrackMan see the club face from behind?

                What does the radar signal look like?

                Why is measured ball flight is better than calculated?

                How much faster is radar over cameras?


                Comment


                • #10
                  Forgot to mention that all of the stories are posted on the TM Blog.

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    Thanks for the reference. Very interesting read.

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      Originally posted by clubchampx9 View Post

                      I'm 10' 11" from screen to tee and 8' 10" from tee to TM. Kevin Noble of TM suggested the yellow ball, not sure why. 10' putts or less can be hit or miss depending on how much uphill or down hill e6 is showing. Downhill works well uphill usually not. I recommend setting e6 to 10' gimmies when playing a round. I only experienced 2 untracked putts for the round. The overall accuracy, left and right is also very good.


                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                      I think 10' gimmies is just too long in real life. I try to set it up at 2' as that reflects real life. But TrackMan support did tell me that they don't track below 6' well. Well, even 6' was kind of long to me though as it's almost one male height length. Maybe 4' will be the sweet spot.

                      For the screen it's better to have at least 12' from tee to screen. I have enough room for 15' but I felt 12' would be the most ideal distance.

                      Comment


                      • LEO MODE
                        LEO MODE commented
                        Editing a comment
                        Now I realized that even at 12' it still calculates ball spin sometimes. But what I realized was that calculating ball spin is not THAT relevant because it just gives you a little bit more or less distance for the ball roll. But if you play a simulator game, there are other factors factoring in anyway so to me what's more important is the ball flight/trajectory, and Trackman seems to catch that pretty well indoor.

                    • #13
                      Had 6 Trackmans in my indoor facilities got rid of them... now happily only use SkyTrak.

                      Comment


                      • 72solstice
                        72solstice commented
                        Editing a comment
                        Igor, could you restate why you got rid of the Trackmans?? I'm not seeing the answer to that here.

                    • #14
                      Originally posted by Igor-247-golf View Post
                      Had 6 Trackmans in my indoor facilities got rid of them... now happily only use SkyTrak.
                      What six did you have and what was it that you did not like about them?

                      Comment


                      • #15
                        Originally posted by Dax View Post
                        I have been reading through a lot of things written on TM over the past few weeks and was surprised at some of the things that I read. In response to some of the questions above, there is an annual fee with TM and when you buy the first years fees are covered. $1k is for the hardware and the other is for listening and allows you to get continuous updates. Neither of these are mandatory and you can still use the unit without paying these annual amounts.

                        The more distance the better. The primary reason for stating a minimum of ten feet is to ensure the unit picks up accurate spin measurements. Ball spin is not estimated as someone posted recently in another thread. You have to put a metal dot on the ball for TM to get the spin numbers in the short distance that it can track the ball. I have between 11 and 12 feet tee to screen and for my swing speed with a driver it is enough to pick up almost all of my shots (sometimes I don't get a reading as I am still trying to find the perfect tee to use. The one I use now still seems to cause the very rare none read when it goes flying. The higher the ball speed and the lower the spin rate is what will require one to have more distance to the screen. There is a good chart on the TM site that can be used to help with this decision.

                        Another thing i read somewhere was that club speed is measured after impact and I am not sure where that came from as the unit tracks the club throughout the swing and don't know why one would star this especially when TM defines club speed to be the speed of the club immediately prior to impact.

                        One thing that i cant believe is that after all these years there has yet to be a head to head comparison between TM indoors and another launch monitor. I find this very strange indeed and has me thinking that I might pick up a used CG2 when they start becoming available to do some testing. This will also hopefully allow me to start playing TGC online, which is something that has intrigued me for sometime as it sounds like others are having a lot of fun.

                        What tests i have seem using using the TM indoors is that when TM does it's testing it appeared they were using very expensive cameras to validate the results that the unit was reporting. I also recall watching a video that I believe was from Japan where the creators of skytrack I believe were validating their monitors results with what a TM was reporting.

                        Not specific to TM, but do recall also reading somewhere that someone used flightscope indoors and noted how inaccurate it was, but also noted that no metallic sticker was put on the ball. I can see why they would say the results were poor as they used the unit indoors and missed having one of the key things required to get accurate results.

                        While i have not checked this in a while, I do believe that spin axis still gets calculated due to the short distances. I suspect the calculations with TM4 would be pretty good given the more accurate data that it captures for the computations. Again something that needs to be tested.

                        Another thing that i have read is with setting up and aligning TM. What I can say is that set-up is very simple you ensure that the unit is at the same height as your hitting area and then you set the distance from tee to screen and from the camera point to your target (I usually put something on the floor in front of the screen that gives me a visual on my line when hitting). This literally takes 30 seconds to do if you had to set up the unit before your session). Once this is done, then you are good to start hitting shots.
                        I also always thought TM was inferior indoor vs Foresight. But at PGA Superstore I brought my TM4 and compared with GC2 with FSX software there. Interesting even bad shanked shots TM4 read it closely than GC2. I do suspect maybe GC2 needs recalibration but how the ball was going was different than TM4.

                        For instance when I shanked the ball to the right, the ball did go to the right. TM4 showed the ball went to the right but Foresight showed going from the right then coming back to the middle. I shanked the ball, I didn’t hook the ball lol.

                        Well I am hoping to receive GC2+HMT demo soon and if there is anyone in Southern California who has a GC Quad and wants to try TrackMan 4, we can meet up in my house and I can show you my indoor simulator and we can compare the devices!

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X