Projectors for Golf Simulators 101

[Maverick]

Great site to compare projectors and check throw distances.

https://Www.projectorcentral.com

[Dax]

Are you going to the projector calculator section. You should be able to select the projector then I put the image size you are looking for and from that it should tell you the distances the particular projector needs to be from the screen to get your desired image.

[ryanoneill1]

I might be searching incorrectly. I am looking for 1920x1080 resolution with 3-4K Lumens. My throw distance is 13 feet. The screen I purchased is 11 feet wide by 8 feet tall. I believe that means the diag. length is 13.5 feet. Not 100% sure on that, but

When I put in image size of 120 inches Wide and 13 feet throw distance I get a ton of projectors
When I put in images size of 162 inches Diag and 13 feet throw distance I get 1 projector

Which is correct using the diagonal or the width? Also is my math correct that if my screen is 11 feet wide by 8 feet tall the diagonal is 13.5?

[Hoosierdaddy]

your math is correct. But not sure on how you use the calculator on that site.

[Hoosierdaddy]

Go to link in previous post. then at the bottom of the calculator there is highlighted words that read "old calculator". There you can select all kinds of stuff to narrow your search. I selected 1920 x1080 res and 10000-20000 contrast diagonal of 150 inches and 13 ft throw distance. I chose 150 diagonal because you won't want from edge to edge. I got 8 projectors. Many will argue that contrast is not a factor but I started with a 3800 lumen projector with 800:1 contrast. good but not great still had to have almost all light out of the room or the picture looked washed. Then I got a 3400 lumen with 10000:1 contrast. much better and I could have much more light in the room without washing the picture. Then I went to a 3000 lumen unit with 20000:1 contrast. And I really don't know how it could get much better. The picture with all the lights on is nearly as good as with no lights on. I can actually turn it on eco and it is still much brighter than the 3800 lumen unit was. I watched a youtube video once were they were comparing projectors and they had a 1500 lumen projector with 20000:1 contrast and all the other stats the same as a 3500 lumen unit with 2000:1 contrast and the picture was so much more bright on the 1500 lumen unit. Then they turned on a single lamp in the room and it was amazing the difference. I am sold that contrast plays a big part in the brightness of the picture. That is when you have lights on in the room. With no light they all look OK. But even then you can get by with smaller lumen numbers and have just as good if not better picture.

[Dax]

I would narrow your search first by projector. For instance some that have been recommended here and which fit your budget. For instance, the W1070 that someone just listed as being on sale for a great price would need the following throw distance in order to achieve your 11 foot wide screen ( I used a 16:9 aspect ratio, which gives you an 11 foot wide image that will be 6'2 in height).

Based on these measurements, you could acheive a 13 foot throw distance utilizing the zoom feature on the 1070. However, pay attention to the room brightness details. At this image size, you should not have any ambient light. You might find this to be enough, but depending on your screen type, you could be very disappointed.

I hope this example helps.

[aja]

Good advice. I'll add my 2 cents.

These days most projectors, not all, but most are oriented for wide screen projection. The screen you purchased is basically a 4:3 format. Widescreen formats are generally 16:10 and 16:9. If you project a widescreen image onto your screen you will have bands at the top and bottom with no image. You can configure a widescreen projector to give a 4:3 image, but then the throw distance changes. http://www.projectorcentral.com/ is a very good place to work out projection distances for various projection formats using their calculator tool.

Play around with all the settings. You can access the calculator for specific projectors by clicking on the "Throw Dist" link embedded in the specs.

Going down the page choose Video/games under Primary use.

If given as a choice, choose the mounting location that you will be using, Floor or Ceiling.

The native aspect ratio for that projector will be shown as the highlighted selection. All the info that the calculator shows is based on this selection, and the inputs related to image size/screen width.

Make sure that you use the same units for all your projector comparisons (feet, inches, meters, centimeters).

Next, and this I believe is where most people get a little lost. Do not use "Screen Diagonal" as your value for screen size. Screen diagonal is a TV manufacturer's ruse designed to impress customers with how big the TV is. If you've gone from 4:3 format monitors to the new widescreen monitors you will note that the actual height of the image has shrunk but the width increased. The widescreen has a greater "diagonal size", but the widescreen "diagonal" has no relation to the 4:3 format's "diagonal".

In short, don't get hung up on your impact screen's "diagonal". That will vary relative to the projection format that you choose. Instead, enter your desired projection image's WIDTH as the criteria for which the calculator will work out the throw distance. Your screen width is a known value. The projected image's "diagonal" and "height" will change according to the projection format 16:9, 4:3, etc)

Play around with the Throw Distance Calculator tool. Change the selection on the chosen projection image format and see what happens to Throw distance.

Also pay attention to the "Image Brightness" number that the calculator comes up with for each variation of your input settings. "Image Brightness" is in relatively small print, right in the middle of the screen, just under the flesh coloured box with sliders for seating and room lighting.

In essence, you can choose to project a widescreen image onto your 4:3 format screen. The image though will not fill all the available screen and there will be white bands above or below (or both) the widescreen picture. But you can also finagle a 4:3 image from a widescreen projector by changing it's settings and the throw distance.

The Throw distance that the calculator works out is pretty accurate. And there really is not much wiggle room in terms of much closer or much farther than the calculated value.

Last piece of advice, don't discount short throw projectors, and don't get too hung up on throw distance before starting your search. Projectors that are farther from the screen will create shadows on the screen (of the golfer), projectors that are closer (short throw) won't create shadows but depending on location can be in the line of fire of lob shots, etc.

[Ghoppa]

Guys,
Im a total newbie to the Forum and looking at all the components and looking for feed back on the projector for my studio build, I am looking at a 10x10x10 footprint and was wondering how this projector would perform on the floor in front of the mat??

BenQ MP776ST Short Throw DLP Digital Video Projector????

looking to spend wisely and wanted to spend correctly but not overspend based on what I have been looking at so far (been at it for 2 weeks, as far as researching on DIY Golf Studios)

-SkyTrak Launch Monitor (in hopes that the partnership with TGC happens for sim play)
-Cimarron 10x10x10 Gage to build off of
-Carl's Golf Impact Screen (but still uncertain regarding the "stuff" I've read about screens w/grommets and avoiding them vs screens w/a sleeve for a pipe to run the width? feedback wanted on this
-Country Club Elite 5x5 Mat
-Projector????

I have no Idea where to begin on the projector, it will mainly be used for golf simulation, no need or desire to use it for movie or sport viewing what so ver, just golf studio..

looking for feedback..
thx in advanced,

[ryanoneill1]

I am no expect, but just finished my build. My footprint(basement) is 13w 14d 9 h. I went with
TrueStrike Mk7 Single Mat - Golfsmith with 15% coupon =$600
WestCoast Netting. I did a cage with a PR-20 as the impact screen. Because I am in the basement and don't trust my friends I didn't want the ball to bounce off the concrete = $550
Skytrak used units from skygolf $1800
Projector BenQ BEMX631ST MX631ST 3200-Lumen XGA Short-Throw DLP Projector =$550
HP PC=$920

I was told to give 1 foot distance between screen and wall for bounce. So if you use that method you might only have 9 foot throw. You can input your screen size and throw distance here http://www.projectorcentral.com/projectors.cfm

I think the big thing with the projector is the throw distance(distance from projector to screen).

[Boerdoc]

Go to link in previous post. then at the bottom of the calculator there is highlighted words that read "old calculator". There you can select all kinds of stuff to narrow your search. I selected 1920 x1080 res and 10000-20000 contrast diagonal of 150 inches and 13 ft throw distance. I chose 150 diagonal because you won't want from edge to edge. I got 8 projectors. Many will argue that contrast is not a factor but I started with a 3800 lumen projector with 800:1 contrast. good but not great still had to have almost all light out of the room or the picture looked washed. Then I got a 3400 lumen with 10000:1 contrast. much better and I could have much more light in the room without washing the picture. Then I went to a 3000 lumen unit with 20000:1 contrast. And I really don't know how it could get much better. The picture with all the lights on is nearly as good as with no lights on. I can actually turn it on eco and it is still much brighter than the 3800 lumen unit was. I watched a youtube video once were they were comparing projectors and they had a 1500 lumen projector with 20000:1 contrast and all the other stats the same as a 3500 lumen unit with 2000:1 contrast and the picture was so much more bright on the 1500 lumen unit. Then they turned on a single lamp in the room and it was amazing the difference. I am sold that contrast plays a big part in the brightness of the picture. That is when you have lights on in the room. With no light they all look OK. But even then you can get by with smaller lumen numbers and have just as good if not better picture.

Hoosierdaddy,
What projector did you get? I would rather emulate what already works rather than experiment on my own. I will be using similar distances as you. I will be getting the 14x10 from protee but I will only be able to use 14x9. Ceiling height is 9'6"

When I use your numbers. 1920x1080, 150 diagonal, 13 ft throw, 10,000-20,000:1 contrast, I get 9 projectors but all of them are 10,000:1 contrast. Not any were 20,000:1. Any help appreciated.

[Hoosierdaddy]

http://www.projectorreviews.com/optoma/optoma-hd141x-projector-review/

this is what I have. And I love it.

[Boerdoc]

Hoosierdaddy,
What projector did you get? I would rather emulate what already works rather than experiment on my own. I will be using similar distances as you. I will be getting the 14x10 from protee but I will only be able to use 14x9. Ceiling height is 9'6"

When I use your numbers. 1920x1080, 150 diagonal, 13 ft throw, 10,000-20,000:1 contrast, I get 9 projectors but all of them are 10,000:1 contrast. Not any were 20,000:1. Any help appreciated.

Thank you for the info. My 2 considerations are:

Optoma HD141X that has a throw distance of 20'7" to project 160"x90".

Acer H6510BD that has a throw distance of 17'4" to project 160"x90".

Any concerns about shadows being projected with these. I will be using the Pro-tee player distance of 10 ft to screen and ceiling height of 9'6".

[Hoosierdaddy]

Thank you for the info. My 2 considerations are:

Optoma HD141X that has a throw distance of 20'7" to project 160"x90".

Acer H6510BD that has a throw distance of 17'4" to project 160"x90".

Any concerns about shadows being projected with these. I will be using the Pro-tee player distance of 10 ft to screen and ceiling height of 9'6".

I don't have a clue. But I will be able to answer that within the next week or so. I am moving my sim to a new location that will be set up almost exactly like your's. My old location had tall ceilings and the golfer was set up at 8.6 from the screen and there was a shadow of shoulders up on the screen. Projector was 20+ feet from screen and about 10ft high. A short throw projector is the best. But then again you are putting the projector near the golfer. At my very first set up there was a garage door opener directly above the ball and that thing got hit several times on the follow through of shall we say less experienced players. I did some checking and measuring prior to taking everything down so I could run electrical were it was needed and I found out that I had a lot of zoom left on the projector, so I could have had the projector much closer than I did. At the new location I will mount the projector as close as possible and let you know. But I don't use the 16:9 I use 4:3. I find that best for my screen.

[ks-man]

Been doing a lot of reading and posting in different threads. This is probably the best place to put a few of the projector related questions I have. My ceiling height is 9'6" and my total room depth is about 18'. I'm almost definitely going with a 10' wide screen due to a soffit which limits the height in the room past 10' wide. This almost certainly means a 4:3 screen as I don't think 10' is wide enough for a 16:9 format screen. I don't have much of an opinion on how far I will hit from the screen (figured it would be about 9-10' but that's just a guess). I don't like the idea of shadows so I'm planning on a short throw projector. Based on my screen width it looks like I'd be about 7' back from the screen for the projector which I would think is fine.

1) Is there any downside to getting an HD projector and switching from its native resolution to a 4:3 format as opposed to getting something with a native 4:3 format (like XGA or UXGA)?

2) I see many people saying how far their hitting spot is from the screen or where their projector needs to be mounted. Which should I consider first? At this point I feel like I'm not limited and can choose the ideal hitting location and projector mount spot. Is this correct? Should I choose the projector I want first and from there determine where it would need to be mounted and then where I want to hit from or is a better starting point the desired distance to hit from and then choose a projector that can be mounted a couple of feet in front of that? I am considering ProTee which means halogen lights but I think those would be angled so shouldn't really matter much for this decision.

3) My room should be pretty dark as it's in the basement and the two window wells in the room are behind where the screen is going to go which I guess will block most of the natural light. Based on this should 2000-2200 lumens be fine or do people still like to go higher so they can play with regular room lights on (I have four can lights in the room).

4) When I go to the calculator on ProjectorCentral and looked at the Acer H7550ST I don't see a number for how far above or below the center of the lens the image will start. It just shows the projector in the center of the picture. Does this mean they don't have the data for this projector? I can't imagine the projector height truly needs to be at the middle of the screen.

Thanks.

[aja]

Think you are on the right track choosing 4:3 screen ratio as that is what your space allows. Now, re. your other questions.

1) If you get a true HD 1080p projector you should get a sharper image, even with a 4:3 image format. Reason being, the HD projector has more lines of resolution vertically than XGA and UXGA. When using the widescreen HD projector to get a 4:3 image you would normally get black bars on both sides of the projected (16:9) image. In order to fill your 4:3 screen you will have to move the projector further back from the screen, changing the throw distance. You can use the throw distance calculator in www.projectorcentral.com to work this out, although it's pretty tricky. Basically you have to do some math with the differences in the image ratios vs. throw distance.

2) Hitting position and projector location are somewhat independent, yet related. Most sim users have their hitting location about 10 feet from the impact screen. Most manufacturers recommend this distance. see: http://csc.protee-united.com/entries...tor-dimensions.

With respect to your thought that ProTee lights can be angled - No they should not be. Protee is a shadow based system and requires that the light source be directly above the sensors.

3) I have a 3000 lumens short throw projector in a windowless room and find it adequate with no other light source. I can play with some other room lights on, but then the screen image is more faint. I don't think you will want to be playing with room lights on.

4) Projectors shown with the projector centered in the middle of the screen don't have built in offset. You use the keystone adjustment to adjust the screen image so that it compensates for whether you are projecting up or down form the centered image position.

[ks-man]

Thanks Aja,

So using the BenQ HT1085ST as an example. I see in the ProjectorCentral Calculator that for a 120" screen it has a Throw Range of 9'2" to 11'1". Assuming I hit from around 10 feet the projector would be just under 1 foot in front of me. Will that leave me enough room to install the shadow lights and also feel free to swing without hitting the projector? I don't think a club goes that high but not really sure. I could probably back up to 11 feet for hitting location or try and find a projector that is more in the 7-8' range from the screen.

Also, the 1085ST doesn't seem to have a built in offset from the calculator so I guess that means the keystone adjustment. I was reading that it hurts resolution and not ideal to use keystone. Is that a reason to shy away from that projector? It's surprising b/c the 1080ST says -2" but is a little dimmer. How much does the keystone adjustment hurt resolution? I also liked the Acer 7550 due to the 3000 lumens but looks like that would require keystone also.

Thanks again.

[aja]

Hi KS! I spent quite a bit of time with a drafting program to figure out where my lights, camera and sensor (for ProTee) were going to be positioned so that I could determine the available location for a projector.

If it looks like your projector is about 1 foot in front of the hitting area of the ProTee sensor, you just might be in the area where the projector won't get in the way of the lights. You should be aware that if a ProTee light is in front of the projector it could interfere with the brightness of the projected image by washing it out.

About the feeling that you are going to hit the projector with your club during or after a swing, think about the golf swing. During the back swing and during the follow through, the club is behind you. The club is never directly above you or the ball during these parts of the golf swing.

The projector is actually in front of you, in line with the center line of the room and on the target line of the ball. The only time your club should be on the center line or target line is when it is at it's lowest point of the swing, the point of contact with the ball. Top of the back swing and during follow-through the club should be behind the golfer, well away from the center line and the projector.

I'd suggest you use the ProTee recommended set-up dimensions to understand where the floor sensor should be placed as well as the overhead lights an camera. If you move your hitting location back from the screen, more shots (from lofted clubs) will be hitting the ceiling and not the impact screen. 10 feet away is basically the agreed on distance + / -.

I would also look for a 3000 lumens projector vs. 2000 lumens.

The keystone issue I believe is exagerated. That being said, I have an Optoma projector and because it has an offset image, I have had to use a very minimal amount of keystone correction and there was no noticeable change in the image.

One thing that can help is if you can buy a projector from a retailer that has a generous return policy. Buy it and play around with it in the space that you are planning on building out. You will then also be able to determine the throw distance that you will need for a 4:3 image from a widescreen projector (because of the black bars on the side of the image when projecting 4:3 on a widescreen projector). If the projector isn't going to fit in, then you have the option of returning it.

Lots of details to be scrutinized and considered.

[aja]

Have a look through my post until you get to the pics of the projector between the lights. It'll give you some idea of what to expect.

http://golfsimulatorforum.com/forum/build-your-own/enclosures/34595-protee-sim-room