Handicap Index and *** Optishot Tour

[psgolfer]

With that said we have Pro Tour, with no handicap where everything is just like on the PGA, your score is your score....

Problem with that Catman, is not all of us can shoot 10 under like you, Willy and Vincent. That being said, the more I'm playing opti, the more things I'm learning to bring my score down. I feel we are on the right course here, I like the idea of taking fewer scores from more rounds to determine a persons handicap.

Currently under USGA and RCGA it's the best 10 out of 20 rounds. I like the idea of 3 or 4 of your best out of 12, This way, the lower cap will stay and lower and if a higher cap shoots a good score it will stay with them longer.

I like the road your traveling, might be something to look into further.

[psgolfer]

So here's my suggestion on how the optishot handicapp system should work.

Once you play in the Q school and come out of there to the handicapp division you would have a fair handicapp.

So let's take myself for example. I'm a -7 handicapp. So once I know my handicapp my target for that tournament is to shoot -7 or better to be even par for the tournament. So say for example I shoot - 6,-4,-5 for the tournament. I would be 7 over par. So now for next tournament I might be a handicapp of -5. And I end up shooting better scores because the course was playing easier. So the scores are -10,-8,-12. So in therory u would be -9 for tournament but I would be at even par because I shot my targeted number for the tournament.

So then say the guy is a 10 handicap and shoots +10,+8 and +12 he would end up at 2 over par. But say he plays on a easy couse with the same handicapp if 10 and shoots a 68,72,69 then he would have shot his handicap so in that case he would be at even par and tied with who ever else's shoots there handicapp. Then for tie breakers you could look on score card and count back wards from hole 18 to see who has first birdie or so on.


That way everybody has a number to shoot for and if they do they can at least be in contention each week.

What you just explained is exactly how it is now. Your the -7 and KNB is the 2.

I was kidding about blowing up your cap, I think there was an LOL in there, if not, I wasn't serious.

[CatMan]

With that said we have Pro Tour, with no handicap where everything is just like on the PGA, your score is your score....

[CatMan]

This is my suggestion on the Handicap, change the max score on hole to Bogey, anything higher system Rejects. System take best 3 Rounds out of 15, so it creates stability... This will also give lower caps a chance....

Like I said initially in my opening comments on the Thread, the System should favor the better Golfer and encourage higher cap players to get better...

[HWoods]

Great posts, tyler. Explains it pretty well.

[tb_tyler]

This is exactly true, the problem is trying to predict these quick learners before the next event when they shoot super low

This too. I'm a 3.8 handicap in real life. Like I said in the post above I had not picked up a club in like 4 months before I saw this online tour. Then I wanted to jump right in. My scores drastically improved because I've essentially played 10 rounds of golf in three weeks. If I did this in real life my game would drastically improve(which I don't because I don't have that much time.)

The other thing to consider is the learning curve of the game--because it is a video game. There are tricks to learn--just like the EA Sports games.

[tb_tyler]

So here's my suggestion on how the optishot handicapp system should work.

Once you play in the Q school and come out of there to the handicapp division you would have a fair handicapp.

So let's take myself for example. I'm a -7 handicapp. So once I know my handicapp my target for that tournament is to shoot -7 or better to be even par for the tournament. So say for example I shoot - 6,-4,-5 for the tournament. I would be 7 over par. So now for next tournament I might be a handicapp of -5. And I end up shooting better scores because the course was playing easier. So the scores are -10,-8,-12. So in therory u would be -9 for tournament but I would be at even par because I shot my targeted number for the tournament.

So then say the guy is a 10 handicap and shoots +10,+8 and +12 he would end up at 2 over par. But say he plays on a easy couse with the same handicapp if 10 and shoots a 68,72,69 then he would have shot his handicap so in that case he would be at even par and tied with who ever else's shoots there handicapp. Then for tie breakers you could look on score card and count back wards from hole 18 to see who has first birdie or so on.


That way everybody has a number to shoot for and if they do they can at least be in contention each week.

If you did this you'd end up with a tie breaker every week. Which would not be fun.

I think the Q school will fix most of the issues as well. One thing I noticed is that I had not really even swing a golf club until I read about this tour. So I jumped all in as quick as possible. Catman set my original cap at -2 which made it impossible to really compete in my first tournament. BUT, it was my first tournament. I shouldn't expect to. Had I gone the Q school route I would improve my play and cap all at the same time. Again, I think this solves the majority of the issues.

Alternatively, this is why there is a Pro Tour. At my local club we have both a club championship and a handicap championship. I never even put my name in the hat for the handicap. I don't want it, and know that I probably wouldn't have a chance to win anyway. If I'm going to play it's for the real deal. In my mind once you hit a certain level on Optishot you should be in the Pro Tour and not even compete in the handicap tour.

[JohnMeyer]

I'm going to add that you can change things all day but when you are done, someone else will complain. As always I'm open to any suggestions but I would recommend that you simply manually override caps of any sandbaggers or quick learners that you find. .

This is exactly true, the problem is trying to predict these quick learners before the next event when they shoot super low

Im confident Q school will fix 90% of the issues, as will time and rounds accumulated. Ultimately without data Catman has to just give his best estimate of what to assign, and with no data other than what he can see, I cant see how he could do a better job.

Jason the above would require all sorts of adjustments to the website I am sure, and ultimately still wouldnt fix the root cause, which is as Hogan identifies, players with too high a cap.

I appreciate its a work around, but hopefully an unneccesary one. The handicap league, once a full q school programme is in place, and all current players have sufficient rounds will be competitive.

For the likes of yourself in the interim, the non handicap league gives you a level footing with the other very good players in order to competitive.

Plus if you just equal your best ever round, something that is totally possible on this course you'll shoot a -2, and be up in the top 5. The mega low scores are just beyond us, but does winning the event really matter youll still be competitive with everyone else

[Willymakit]

So here's my suggestion on how the optishot handicapp system should work.

Once you play in the Q school and come out of there to the handicapp division you would have a fair handicapp.

So let's take myself for example. I'm a -7 handicapp. So once I know my handicapp my target for that tournament is to shoot -7 or better to be even par for the tournament. So say for example I shoot - 6,-4,-5 for the tournament. I would be 7 over par. So now for next tournament I might be a handicapp of -5. And I end up shooting better scores because the course was playing easier. So the scores are -10,-8,-12. So in therory u would be -9 for tournament but I would be at even par because I shot my targeted number for the tournament.

So then say the guy is a 10 handicap and shoots +10,+8 and +12 he would end up at 2 over par. But say he plays on a easy couse with the same handicapp if 10 and shoots a 68,72,69 then he would have shot his handicap so in that case he would be at even par and tied with who ever else's shoots there handicapp. Then for tie breakers you could look on score card and count back wards from hole 18 to see who has first birdie or so on.


That way everybody has a number to shoot for and if they do they can at least be in contention each week.

[HWoods]

I'm going to add that you can change things all day but when you are done, someone else will complain. As always I'm open to any suggestions but I would recommend that you simply manually override caps of any sandbaggers or quick learners that you find. Lots of guys give up when they are going to post a high score but when it's going well, they play with attention. This to me is sandbagging and inflates caps. You can't have a guy who avgs 80 shooting almost 20 shots below his avg and then wonder about the system. No matter what system is in place, it will not stop that.

[HWoods]

Hey hogan I know how a handicapp works so quit attacking me. What doesn't make sense is when you try to use the same system that set up like in real golf. I been playing golf for over 40 years and not once I have I seen a plus 10 handicapp or even a plus 5 or even a plus 2 shoot the scores that I see on here shooting that low. It's called impossible in real life. So why treat it like that.

You don't understand how it works, if you did you'd try and fix the real problem. You need to do a better job as a league with the indexes of your players. If a course this week is that easy - then that's fine but you have to know going in that you won't have a chance. That's just the bottom line. No matter what the system unless you start adjusting guys mid tournament.

Both of these factors are true in real life tournaments. 1 vs 1, a low index has an advantage but in a field of 20+, the odds are a mid/high index will go low at least once. That's what a NET event is. You can't stop this. It will happen no matter what you do. The harder the course, the less advantage you give the higher indexes.

[Willymakit]

I've never seen someone claim to be a + index and not know how a handicap system works.

You have a 2 index in your league who shot 64 / 65.... Game over.

Hey hogan I know how a handicapp works so quit attacking me. What doesn't make sense is when you try to use the same system that set up like in real golf. I been playing golf for over 40 years and not once I have I seen a plus 10 handicapp or even a plus 5 or even a plus 2 shoot the scores that I see on here shooting that low. It's called impossible in real life. So why treat it like that.

[JohnMeyer]

I've never seen someone claim to be a + index and not know how a handicap system works.

You have a 2 index in your league who shot 64 / 65.... Game over.

You say that but before this event he'd never shot below 75, how can anyone predict that he'd go from 75 to 64?

The whole issue is people are suddenly improving soooo much too quickly for handicaps to be accurate.

This is the point of Q school, so that rapid improvement is absorbed in those events and not the Tour Event

Oh and KNB/Sliceomatic, this is not an attack on your or saying you've done anything wrong in any way, its just your results are highlighting the problems in the handicap system we currently have

[Willymakit]

And also that's why there should be some kind of cap. So for example will use knbgolfer has the latest score. If he's a two handicapp and he shoots 9 under like he did. The best score he should recieve should be a -2. That would get him back to even par. Everthing should be based on even par rounds. I know I'm not explaining myself that way it's in my head. Lol. But nobody should be under par when playing handicap golf. Your stats that you keep bringing up states that. So for myself I would have to shoot 7 under par to be even par for handicapp. So if I end up shooting 10 under par the best score I could get would be even par. Does that make sense. It's not how low you go it's how consistent you can shoot to your handicapp.

So say knbgolfer has a-5 handicapp for next tournament he would have to shoot 5 under or better to make par. Sorry for using you knbgolfer has an example.

So what I trying to say is. The winning score should be even par on every tournanent and anything lower would not count. That way there could be more multiple tie breakers If you shoot your handicap. Hopefully this makes sense.

[HWoods]

I've never seen someone claim to be a + index and not know how a handicap system works.

You have a 2 index in your league who shot 64 / 65.... Game over.