A New Era of Optishot

[Buckeye]

Video's are not even Required, I hope this is not were it takes us, kind of unsettling..

There is nothing unsettling really.

I went searching for a round I watched you play where you was exploiting a glitch in the software with the trajectory, in the process I stumbled across what I thought was a tournament round that did not match any submitted score card. I simply asked a few questions regarding a video and you immediately became defensive instead of providing answers.

Personally I think you read to much in to what is asked or proposed around here. You take things to personal instead of holding a rational discussion and coming up with answers or solutions.

I find it odd that you don't archive your "live competition" rounds but do your practice rounds. Maybe I am the only one who sees that as odd, I don't know.

Regardless this thread in particular was about requiring video and setting rules regarding trajectory. Could you give your input publicly on both of those?

Thank you in advance.

[JohnMeyer]

It was my suggestion for this very reason that having a video as evidence of a round would be required. Not necessarily being forced to upload or stream, but just so if anyone questions anything you can just prove it with a video.

I only say this as we are now going to be putting lots of fixed settings into the guidelines and as the software doesn't allow these to be centrally imposed when setting up the games I think there should be a way for the Board to be able to check that for example,Buckeye is using the correct driver setting, or that I didn't select the highest trajectory on my tee shots etc

I know some people would say that most people would be honest, and im sure they would be, but just as a safety net if you had to record it and you knew that you could be asked by the Board to upload the video of a round for checking if they requested it, I think it would definitely make you think twice before breaking any of the rules

Its not a major undertaking, many people already do it, and those that dont, will find it is a very simple procedure. If using OBS software, just set a hotkey for record and one for stop record and just before you tee off , hit that hotkey, to start recording, show your Clubset settings and then play your round as normal. Then at end just stop the recording and thats it

Then if Board are concerned that there has been something strange going on, ie, you hit an eagle on a 350 yard par 4, they could request that video be uploaded and check that you did indeed eagle it buy holing it from the fairway on your second shot, rather than using a boosted driver setting to hit the green and putt it.

I hope most people think this reasonable, for the reasons above and those I stated in the opening post and we can move forward with this

[CatMan]

Video's are not even Required, I hope this is not were it takes us, kind of unsettling..

[CatMan]

Buckeye I love you Man,

now stop it,,,,

[Buckeye]

The only thing that smells is your obsession with me...

Believe me there is no obsession with you. lol

If it was a practice round or whatever you could have simply said so instead of getting so nasty. It seems your immediate reaction to anything anyone posts directed to you is negative. There seems to be no conversation with you.

[CatMan]

Look buckeye I didn't submit any Video all my video's are done Live.... You went into my Twitch and looked at Past Broadcast.... I suspect what you saw was my warm up holes, then I went into match 3.. Just a guess... But my scorecards are still on the Optishot Online Site..... If you continued watching that past Broadcast you would of seen that...

I think you should of PM me if you had question instead of trying to create a public mutiny....

Sorry, you feel the way you do I know Brad watches all my matches Live most of them....

I play with Maxxx and Corey that is the way it is setup their names and scores are on the Cards as well..

The only thing that smells is your obsession with me...


Get over it and move on

[Buckeye]

All you want to do is argue John. I'm completely done with you.

There is an obvious discrepancy between what you submitted and what that video shows. If you was a man of your word as you claim to be you would explain the difference. Instead you simply want to attack.

Fact is no one called you a cheater.

Fact is you were asked to explain why there is a difference.

Fact is you are blowing this up, both here on the forum and in private messages, smells suspicious.

Fact is you have been against everything on this forum I have posted.

I think it is best if we steer clear of each other. Do your thing and I'll do mine.

[CatMan]

Buckeye I am not going to succumb to your attacks brother, If there is a rule I broke please let me know?

[CatMan]

I went to look at CatMan's twitch to find the round I was referring to and it seems it has been deleted or I am unable to find it. However in the process, I stumbled across this round at Warwick form Jan 1st where the scores are not matching up.

CatMan can you tell us what tournament round this is?

http://www.twitch.tv/catmanea/b/605842284

Your score card in game shows par on 10 birdie 11 & 12 and a bogey on 15 and of your three submitted scorecards on ****************** site none of them match so I am unable to tell which round this video is from.

After clearing that up, could you post a link to round 1 2 & 3 for me? I was specifically looking for the round you were using loft on nearly every shot.

Too Funny Buckeye,

Verified Scorecards, Not sure what your seeing But Scorecard are still on site... Just looked at them and they are Good.....

[JohnMeyer]

So I think that's rule 1 sorted. And no major objections to recording so far.

Hopefully we can get these added to the hopefully now sorted club settings and have ourselves some new guidelines in place for a Tour Trial sooner rather than later

[JohnMeyer]

Did some extensive testing with Catman tonight on the issue of trajectory

We tested in all wind speeds, both head and tail winds on standard, + 1 , and highest trajectory settings

Using the standard setting as a baseline we checked the effect altering the trajectory had noting the increase it decrease in yardage

With a head wind we found the trajectory a had no real effect, even in 18mph head winds this proves that there was no real disadvantage in any trajectory setting into a head wind

However when hitting with a tail wind, there was a no real gains when setting to +1 trajectory, however when setting to highest there was a significant gain in distance.


EDIT

I think I've got the exact numbers if you require them on pc so can post if you require precise details but I believe +1 setting only differred to standard by .05 increase to to the ratio at the most when comparing ratios and obviously as per the club loft discussion when hitting into different fairway speeds this will probably be absorbed anyway. I think basically with a strong tail wind it gained around 5 yards on medium fairway but lost 5 yards into a head wind so seemed ok

Highest setting however varied anyway from 0.1 difference at its least to a whole 0.3 I believe at its most which equated I believe in strong winds to a gain of 30-40 yards, however resulted in no lost yards at all into a head wind

Catman agrees this is not acceptable and inconsistent with other settings and as such has agreed that the highest trajectory is not to be used at any time other than special circumstances, ie short game flop shots as it provides an unrealistic increase to distance

I think this a real good piece of testing and can't thank him enough for putting the time in to thoroughly test this before coming to the correct decision

So just to comfirm the proposal now is to ban the use of the highest trajectory altogether other than for special circumstance flop shots

Other than that no restrictions will apply as the +1 setting made negligible difference with any wind setting

I believe there is also to be no more use of the highest wind setting as it brought with it some very odd and exaggerated effects. We al know it messes up putting and it had erratic effects on full shots too so I think this is another great thing to come from the testing

[Buckeye]

I went to look at CatMan's twitch to find the round I was referring to and it seems it has been deleted or I am unable to find it. However in the process, I stumbled across this round at Warwick form Jan 1st where the scores are not matching up.

CatMan can you tell us what tournament round this is?

http://www.twitch.tv/catmanea/b/605842284

Your score card in game shows par on 10 birdie 11 & 12 and a bogey on 15 and of your three submitted scorecards on ****************** site none of them match so I am unable to tell which round this video is from.

After clearing that up, could you post a link to round 1 2 & 3 for me? I was specifically looking for the round you were using loft on nearly every shot.

[MatalaWedge]

My opinion... Any iron. But only when in need of hight. Trees, house, bunker lip. etc. Not when in need of distance... Also think everyone should default to normal hight...

[Buckeye]

For Players that are not long ball hitters by limiting to 3 Iron and below would favor long ball hitters...... This will not be acceptable... Short Ball hitters need to use woods like myself to reach greens....

Players elevate their Trajectory all the time for Carry on to the green... including Woods..

CatMan, serious question:

Did you ever use the trajectory adjustments prior to Maxxx posting that it gave a boost?

I know that the 3 or 4 rounds we played together either streaming or on google hangouts you never made an adjustment during those rounds and you managed to play pretty well. I know from competitions that I have watched you stream that you never (I mean never, I don't believe I can recall you even adjusting for chip or pitch shots) adjusted trajectory and if you did it was DOWN for chip shots.

You and I even had a lengthy discussion regarding trajectory in which I told you I naturally hit the ball high and you showed me how I could set me default trajectory, which I have to one notch up above the middle.

However, ever since Maxxx's post that brought this system "glitch" to the attention of everyone it appears that you have taken it upon yourself to now max out the trajectory for every shot manually, essentially "gaming the system". In my opinion exploiting a clear glitch is pretty much cheating. I must say that the last round you streamed that I watched I was stunned to see the behavior from you in particular, being the "administrator" I would have thought you would have led by example.

Anyways, that has been my honest experience. The others can take it for what it's worth.

Should trajectory adjustments be allowed? Yes, I think so. Personally I believe a 3i is to long of a club to hit with max height as I would rather see the option limited to wedges only. I don't see a need for any restriction on lowering trajectory for any club, including woods and long irons.

My two cents.

[fhann]

That's actually just a recommendation from a user in those forums. That's not an official Dancin' Dogg recommendation. I disagree with his recommendation as well. The weight of an Almost Ball and a real golf ball is totally different. A real golf ball obviously weighs much more. The only difference between an almost golf ball and a normal foam ball is that it's filled with co2 in order to provide better feel when hitting them. The weight is much closer to a foam ball than that of a real ball. This is what the software calculates for the setting, the resistant from the weight of each particular ball and how it affects your club head speed.

Almost Golf balls are lighter than real golf balls. They will have an initial ball speed that will be faster than a real golf ball but will lose speed more rapidly during the flight of the golf ball than a real golf ball. This is just the physics of momentum and conservation of momentum, inertia plus increased ratio of air drag to selfweight of the Almost Golf Ball versus a real golf ball. An algorithm for a real golf ball's distance/flight is immensely difficult/sensitive; I cannot imagine how much more difficult it would be to design an accurate/precise algorithm for the Almost Golf Ball.

Frank Hann
Engineered Golf