SkyTrak with E6 Connect: Club Face & Swing Path - How Is It Measured?

[mschantz]

I just today explored the E6 demo with my SkyTrak and an iPad. I was shocked to see club face angle and swing path data. How is it being measured, and why isn't this info available in the ST software?

And here's the thing: the numbers I was getting were pretty much spot on.

Can anyone shed any light on this?

Thank you.

[intrinsic]

It's calculated, not measured. Or putting it more specifically, it's an assumed value based on a number of other factors. It's not going to be accurate so don't rely on it.

Think of it like the body fat measurement scales. They give you a general idea of BF % but by no means are they accurate.

[3on3putt]

TGC2019 also has clubface data with Skytrak. My guess is that it takes the relevant ball data like horizontal launch angle and spin axis and comes up with an assumed club face angle and swing path.

As a follow up question, how is club data measured on a mevo+ when the unit is so far behind you?

[intrinsic]

“We use doppler radar to track the 3D movement of the club head through the impact zone plus 3D tracking of the golf ball in full flight until landing.

“Our TrackMan 4 utilises two separate radar arrays which track club and ball independently – no other launch monitor offers the dual-radar technology.”
Read more
2. How does Trackman work to capture accurate club data?

How does Trackman work?

“We track the club head knee-high to knee-high taking around 4,000 data points in 0.1 second through this arc, then report key club data without the need to put markers on the club head.

“During the collision moment of half a millisecond (0.0005 second), TrackMan is capable of reporting impact data at the exact moment of maximum compression, measured at the geometric center of the club. This ensures ultra-high precision tracking and eliminates error in data reporting.

“Face angle measurements are created using a combination of the club and ball data.”

https://www.nationalclubgolfer.com/news/tech-talk-how-does-trackman-work/

[3on3putt]

Talking about mevo here, not trackman(?). Or maybe what you're saying is that this is how it works for both units (despite trackmans claim that they are the only launch monitor to do this)

[intrinsic]

3on3putt : yes, I am more suggesting that doppler radar (which both use) is the more important piece to factor in. Mevo+ may not be tracking 4000 datapoints or knee high to knee high info or has the processing power of the trackman, but the principles are still the same. Doppler provides the 3D movement of club head which is how the face angle/path are coming together.

Doppler is doppler in the end. It comes down to algorithms and processing power. It's like a radiologist. They look at scans and see things that us patients/common people probably can't. It's because they have tuned their brain 'algorithms' to see things we don't know to look for. Same for trackman vs mevo+. Trackman's algorithms are likely much more refined an the device has more CPU power to process the details

[DS12]

Agree with the above posts.

Doesn't it assume center face contact on the club "measurements"?

[mschantz]

Thank you two. I figured that's how it was doing it because there's nothing tracking the club, and swing speed is also calculated. I was impressed because the numbers looked to be correct or very close. I know my swing really well and can tell by the ball flight if my face angle and swing path were within my ideal range. And the face angle and swing path matched the ball flights. Come to think of it the swing speed is usually pretty close too. I have a Garmin TruSwing and the numbers compared to SkyTrak are typically within a range of +/- 3-4 mph.

[GungHoGolf]

Agree with the above posts.

Doesn't it assume center face contact on the club "measurements"?

Yes. If you assume center-face contact, and know the static loft of the club in play, you can be scary accurate calculating club data (swing path, face angle, AoA, and Dyn Loft) based on ball flight data.

[skytrakali]

First, take some known ball/swing/club measurements (e.g. from Trackman), then do a linear regression on ball measurement only data to generate a set of coefficients that allows you to figure out the club and swing properties using only ball measurement data. Then use the constants in the ST software to give club and swing properties

It's possible to back out these coefficients. This can be done with a simple Excel regression in about 5 minutes.

Conclusion: for centre strikes and "normal" shots the club and swing data will be very accurate. For non-centre strikes or non-"normal shots" ............. it won't!

[Morini]

Trackman has already published most of the constants. Beyond that, it is just algebra. .. It is just, as you say, using physics to back out club data from the ball data. If struck center face, there is only combination of club head path, face, Aoa, and dynamic loft that produce a given ball parameter. If not struck center face there are infinite combinations that produce given ball parameters.