Garage Build - Insulation Question

[Ironstrokes]

The big buddy isn't an indoor heater as it gives off a ton of carbon monoxide. It even says outdoor use only on the website. They are meant for worksite heating or a patio where it's not sealed in. I'd be really careful there. CO2 has no odour and makes you fall asleep and not wake up. There are cases where people used heaters like that indoors and all died The hot dawg or similar is sealed combustion with exhaust to the outside.

I hear you, I've read a lot of reviews and all about the heaters in doors and the possible dangers. So far I haven't been as concerned yet because my garage still isn't very insulated and I know fumes are escaping. But as long as you get a decent co2 sensor I'm sure you will be good to go. I have a small propane fire place attached to the wall in my basement when i moved in and the inspector even said I didn't have to worry about co2 much because the heater was built with an auto co2 shut off if the room got bad. I've had that running in a small, semi finished basement for 5+ hours before with it never shutting itself of_ or co2 alarms going off. So if that worked actually inside an insulated house, I wouldn't worry too much about the big buddy in a garage. Even if you insulate the garage, it still probably won't be as well insulated as your house. Plus, just make sure your sensor is working and you'll be good to go in my opinion. I've been using it every night for the past few months and had no sense of danger with it yet. As with anything, just be careful and know how to address the risks before trying it

[Gamble Gamble]

Gamble, what's your garage temp without any heat going? Does anyone use a small portable propane heater?

The Garage usually is pretty warm at about 50+ degrees since I insulated it, however when the temps went down to the low teens it felt significantly colder in there. I did not install a thermometer yet to quantify the drop but I would say that my garage is 20-25* warmer than the outside.

My concern is not my comfort but more the longevity of my electronics (computer, projector, GC2/ES16) I do not want to invest $11k into a setup that gets damaged during the first really cold night (sub 10*) I think the foam adhesive should create a better connection.

[Schlueter]

I would not risk using a propane heater indoors..very very bad
But if you do..maybe you could post your address just I case your wife wants to sell a SIM

[Ironstrokes]

I would not risk using a propane heater indoors..very very bad
But if you do..maybe you could post your address just I case your wife wants to sell a SIM

Have you never seen a propane fireplace in a house? They are indoors. As long as there is someway to release the fumes and/or if you have a CO sensor to warn you to turn it off youll be fine. Crack a window or the door or whatever if nervous about it. But ive read pretty much all the reviews of the big buddy heater on amazon at least (100+) and haven't seen anyone mention a loved one dying yet. And I personally have been going strong using it for months now (sometimes 4 or 5+ hours at a time) with not even the slightest negative symptom. Just be smart with it and take the proper precautions while using it indoors. Car accidents themselves cause a ton of deaths but does that mean we should never drive. Stoves can light stuff on fire and burn down a house theoretically, but does that mean we shouldn't cook. You use those things intelligently and take the proper precautions as you should with the propane heater and youll be fine. Honestly, just try it with the door cracked. If you feel any headache, drowsiness or hear the alarms going off then maybe don't use it indoors, but im betting you wont have anything happen, or maybe im just immune to co gas somehow haha

[Ironstrokes]

Anyone interested or concerned can also do a quick Google search for 'can big buddy heater be used indoors' and you'll find several websites saying that it's perfectly fine using it indoors so long as your not basically in an airtight closet. The heater has safety shut off features built into it too with low oxygen levels and all

[aja]

Obviously people are concerned with your safety, and to that end, are providing sound advice.

Remember that this post started with questions about how to insulate a garage and make it tighter in terms of air flow. Now we have mixed in posts about propane heaters and that they are OK as long as the space is not too airtight.

Using common sense, please don't use a propane heater indoors and rely on a CO detector to warn you of danger. CO detectors also fail. Bottom line, combustion indoors, propane or otherwise, can be dangerous, especially when you are trying to minimize airflow (ventilation) in the area that you are heating.

Electric heaters are a much less dangerous option.

I build airtight houses, so please listen.

[Ironstrokes]

Obviously people are concerned with your safety, and to that end, are providing sound advice.


Remember that this post started with questions about how to insulate a garage and make it tighter in terms of air flow. Now we have mixed in posts about propane heaters and that they are OK as long as the space is not too airtight.

Using common sense, please don't use a propane heater indoors and rely on a CO detector to warn you of danger. CO detectors also fail. Bottom line, combustion indoors, propane or otherwise, can be dangerous, especially when you are trying to minimize airflow (ventilation) in the are that you are heating.

Electric heaters are a much less dangerous option.

I build airtight houses, so please listen.

I hear your advice and believe it is sound up to a point. But when I've had house inspectors say its ok to use because the propane heaters that have fail safes built into them to shut off before it even gets close to any real danger on top of co detectors, I'm gonna take their advice. And heck, buy multiple detectors, I'm sure one of them are bound to work of you buy 8 of them. Looking up the research on my heaters, having home inspectors tell me they are fine to use indoors for multiple hours at a time with the proper heaters and precautions, and having done it myself for a long while now is all I need to know.

If your gonna be scared of that and worried about safety, would it also be reasonable to tell people not to drive ever because your car may have some sort of major failure of a key safety feature built into it and you'd get into a car accident that could cause serious harm (not to mention the possibility of other drivers hitting you) and thus never drive because of that possible danger. Or even something like a table saw, who's to say something might fail with that and be life threatening as well.

I do have electric heaters but don't have the 240v on my garage that would be needed for the legit heaters. Propane is cheaper as a fuel, saves money on running special electric lines for that and works well for heating up my space with no harm that I've come across personally. I do suggest everyone use caution when using them, but to just say they are all straight unsafe to use indoors at any time just doesn't seem to be true if you do the research online on certain heaters and do it right. Just as with a car, table saw, etc, use the heaters as a tool, respect what they do, take proper precautions and continue living your life with what that tool can do for you

[fortysixandtwo]

Gamble do you have pics of the garage with foam board? Is it a finished garage? I kept my projector mounted in the garage all year and tv with no issues and usually it's in the 50's during the winter in the garage. If it's really cold outside it can get in the high 40's.
I used that expanding foam sealer fro some of the cracks around my side door frame and other areas.

[Boerdoc]

Using a propane heater indoors may not kill you (directly), but chronic exposure has been shown to reduce lifespan by 7 years. It increases the risk of cardiovascular disease and fetal abnormalities. This is just like smoking. Smoking one cigarette will not kill you directly but chronic exposure is devastating to many people, though not all. Chronic exposure affects the oxygen that is carried in your blood stream. Like the frog in warming water, you do not know that it is harming you until it is too late.

Please see wikipedia on Carbon monoxide poisoning. While you are at it, google carbon monoxide poisoning and look at the news. In the last week there have been numerous deaths due to accidental poisonings.

Whereas many detectors go off at a specified setting, lower levels are still harmful long term.
These are some guidelines that may help reduce long term exposure and resultant harm. If you must use propane indoors, get a CO2 monitor that has a digital readout and not just one that has an alarm.

World health organization. The following guideline values (ppm values rounded) and periods of time-weighted average exposures have been determined in such a way that the carboxyhaemoglobin (COHb) level of 2.5% is not exceeded, even when a normal subject engages in light or moderate exercise:

• 100 mg/m3 (87 ppm) for 15 min
• 60 mg/m3 (52 ppm) for 30 min
• 30 mg/m3 (26 ppm) for 1 h
• 10 mg/m3 (9 ppm) for 8 h

For indoor air quality 7 mg/m3 (6 ppm) for 24 h (so as not to exceed 2% COHb for chronic exposure)


Remember, with carbon monoxide, it is the concentration of CO over time that poses a threat. Since carbon monoxide displaces oxygen in your blood, it can harm you if you are exposed to either high levels of CO in a short period of time, or to lower levels of CO over a longer period of time.
Current UL Standard 2034 limits for CO alarms to sound are: •

30ppm for 30 days
150ppm for 10-50 minutes
70ppm for 60-240 minutes
400ppm for 4-15 minutes

My suggestion from a previous post on this subject was to use the propane heater to get it warmed up and use the electric to maintain the heat. Let's be practical about this.

I use 1500 watt heaters, 110v. to heat my space that is 16x28x10feet. One heater to keep it at 50 degrees or above set on a thermostat. One heater that I turn on by an app on my phone 30 minutes before playing to get it comfy. We get down to 0 degrees F on occasion and this system works for me.

[TaS]

So, if you're married, use propane?

[Ironstrokes]

That usually what I do anyway because it will get too hot with the propane heater on for too long. But the electric heater by itself does really do much at all to keep the temperature up. I understand there may be long term effects as there probably is with a ton of things we regularly use and are exposed to and may not even realize it. My main point was people seem to act like it's going to kill you the second you start using it indoors and that just simply isn't true. I bought my house from two like 70+ year old people and the gentleman was still climbing on the roof and fixing everything in his house himself and looked like he could continue to do so for the foreseeable future and had been using those propane heaters and fireplace in the house for the 40+ years they were there. I'm basically just saying, don't be afraid to use it indoors if that's the best way you have available to you to heat it right now

[bradski]

Im in th es process of buying a new house and it looks like im going to have the sim in the garage. I plan on making sure the door is insulated and sealed. There is insulation in all of the walls already. I was thinking wall ac unit and electric heater.

What else have people done to keep the temp stable in the winter and summer? Who has a garage sim in a warm/cold climate?

[fortysixandtwo]

I'm going to run 220 out to the garage for next season, I have one electric heater in the garage that works ok for moderately cold days but when the temp drops to 20F or less, the garage can't warm up past mid 40's without running a second electric heater from another adjacent room circuit. I'm hoping 220 will be the answer next season..

[bubs3141]

I use a propane heater. Works great heats the room from 45 degrees to 60 degrees in 30 minutes. Then I shut that off and use a vortex electric heater to heat it the rest of the way.

[Gamble Gamble]

I think the key to fixing the problem is to plug the gaps with insulation foam first. Once I did that the room never gets below 50 when the door is closed. With a 1500W/120V Honeywell heater I can keep the temp at 57-60* even when it is 0* outside.