SkyTrak Launch Monitor

[Maverick]

http://www.skytrakgolf.com/

iPad app:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/com.sporttrak.skytrak/id876548058?mt=8

[fhann]

hey frank,
on the flightscope optimizer, what numbers are you using for launch angle (h) and altitude?

when i put in just the ball speed (94), launch angle (v) (30.7), ball spin (8098) and and spin axis (left 1.6) i get 121 carry and 126 total. just trying to see where you are getting 111 yards.

I used a ball speed of 90 mph and sea level elevation of zero. If I was wrong inputting the ball speed, I guess my eyes are not good enough to see the number correctly.

[fhann]

First off, no offense at all. I am trying to figure things out, that's all and I appreciate your insight. For the record, I put the data from my shot on post 840 into optimal flight and got 75.2 carry. That is between FS and ST but a whole lot closer to FS (66, 75, 80). And its also well within the range I can say makes sense. I know within a range how far a well-struck golf ball will go. I also know the miss. These aren't based on the once in a lifetime "I can hit it THIS far" but are based on hitting it squarely. Everybody nukes one sometimes - that;s not my number. I still don't understand why the algorithm is different for a driver versus an iron, unless the calculations are super complex and in order to simplify would reply on a set of assumptions that work within a relevant range. With computers, seems like that would not be necessary. I guess I will just have to accept that I may never understand that part and get back to figuring out how to achieve my golf goals: I have worked very hard over the last few years to make the percentage of well-struck go up.. It has. Now its time to hone in on the scoring clubs. I want more than to know that an 80% gap wedge will be about 90 yards if I hit it right and that an 80% sand wedge will go about 80. I want to get to the point of having an 85 yard shot, an 80 at 75, etc. as well as working on direction control with feedback throughout the winter. So figuring out this tool is how I will accomplish that. And I am confident that I will. just a matter of seeing enough info to make sense of it all. Again, thanks for your insights.

The spin rates for wedges are nearly 5 times greater than drivers and therefore, lift and drag are more acute factors with respect to travel distance. Ball flight is not modeled nor calculated on simple projectile basis but have numerous other factors that influence the outcome. The calculations are very complex, you do need to be a rocket scientist to be able to understand and perform them. I an not a rocket scientist, just a stupid engineer.

I feel that the spin rates that you have seen on the SkyTrak are low for wedges, especially if you have a negative angle of attack. I have seen the range balls at my course behave very differently than my ball that I usually play with on the course.

Did you use a range ball that spins less than say a ProV1? The launch angle and spin rates would be lower and consequently the data would could output longer distances. The opposite conditions would output data that would have resulted in lesser distances.

[Jel]

Just looked on the App store and you can now download Xswing ( https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/xswi...942837151?mt=8 )

It might be worth testing it against SkyTraks app to see if the short irons register differently. I don't have mine yet but will once I receive it.

[Mike Z]

Well, I'm not an engineer either nor a rocket scientist, just an accountant (so the world tends to be a linear place in my mind) but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express.... Anyway makes sense about the amount of spin effecting the shots more the higher it is.Lift, drag and all that stuff they tried to teach me when I was younger. There has to be one equation that fits it whether its exponential, differential or something I have never heard of, so most likely the algorithms being used is an attempt at a close approximation of that equation that relies on some assumptions that favor some area of the spectrum over another. As for my shots, I have been using shag balls (read - junk) and I broke out a sleeve of the freebies they sent with they unit to see what effect it had. If anything, I would expect my spin to be lower with these balls than what I use on the course. I will end up getting a dozen of those (RZN Black) to use so I am removing an variable. That said, I would expect the spin to go up and the distances to go down with the wedges and the like. What effect does hitting off of an artificial surface over turf have, I wonder. Guess I am going to have to get my head wrapped around what reasonable launch and spin numbers are for each club to help me frther evaluate the shots I am taking. Will be hitting more tonight.

[pctekbr]

So, do we sit back and wait for an update or does someone need to contact skytrak with the new information we have about shorter clubs? i am hoping the skytrak guys are monitoring this thread and will reply with an update soon. If not, i don't want to risk holding on to a device that only gets half of my club distances correct.

[hks8888]

Just looked on the App store and you can now download Xswing ( https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/xswi...942837151?mt=8 )

It might be worth testing it against SkyTraks app to see if the short irons register differently. I don't have mine yet but will once I receive it.

I received my unit this afternoon and am charging it now. I should be able to do the indoor test tonight and will go out to a range tomorrow morning.
For the indoor test, I can include Xswing which I already installed on my IPad. I have Ipad 3rd generation and apparently I have the oldest IPad in this forum. Will see if the older IPad works okay.

[Mike Z]

pctekbr, I have re-read this several times, and part of it reads to me like you could take it as an attack on you and its not. I just cant find a way to word it better and say what I want to say. I completely understand your position and respect it. I am going to wait for some more reviews to come in. If they were monitoring before they surely are now. I am sure they are waiting for a larger sample size before much happens update-wise I can live with that. That said, I am sure they will be more than receptive of your feedback and I am also sure that even though this a low-price option its still a lot of money and if you aren't happy you should act on that. That said while I have been trying to figure this out to the best of my ability, I think a dose pf perspective is in order. I am almost certain that there is no perfect system out there. There are tradeoffs. The tradeoff I knowingly made with this is that it fit my budget, will fit in a confined space (though I could also use a Flightscope XI in my current space I am not sure its long term), I can have it now and for a discount I ordered early knowing full well that, as with cars, software and presumably this product, there are issues to be worked out that being used by the "masses" flushes out. At this point I am content knowing what it does well and what I have to mentally adjust. No different in my mind than playing in a 1 club wind, you make the adjustment and evaluate accordingly. For the comparative cost of the alternatives, I think this is a winner and it will only get better. The package isn't perfect but I wasn't expecting it would be. I was expecting good enough to help me get better and it will deliver that. So I do want it better, but I am not dissatisfied.

[Jel]

Also just realized theres a iPhone version of Xswing (https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/xswi...838795668?mt=8).

[pctekbr]

pctekbr, I have re-read this several times, and part of it reads to me like you could take it as an attack on you and its not. I just cant find a way to word it better and say what I want to say. I completely understand your position and respect it. I am going to wait for some more reviews to come in. If they were monitoring before they surely are now. I am sure they are waiting for a larger sample size before much happens update-wise I can live with that. That said, I am sure they will be more than receptive of your feedback and I am also sure that even though this a low-price option its still a lot of money and if you aren't happy you should act on that. That said while I have been trying to figure this out to the best of my ability, I think a dose pf perspective is in order. I am almost certain that there is no perfect system out there. There are tradeoffs. The tradeoff I knowingly made with this is that it fit my budget, will fit in a confined space (though I could also use a Flightscope XI in my current space I am not sure its long term), I can have it now and for a discount I ordered early knowing full well that, as with cars, software and presumably this product, there are issues to be worked out that being used by the "masses" flushes out. At this point I am content knowing what it does well and what I have to mentally adjust. No different in my mind than playing in a 1 club wind, you make the adjustment and evaluate accordingly. For the comparative cost of the alternatives, I think this is a winner and it will only get better. The package isn't perfect but I wasn't expecting it would be. I was expecting good enough to help me get better and it will deliver that. So I do want it better, but I am not dissatisfied.

mike,
you can't hurt my feelings or feel like you are attacking me. i have pretty thick skin.
don't get me wrong, i like the product. i just find it strange that i can't call anyone for help or complain. So, that makes me a little uncomfortable.
i don't want a product that doesn't give me the correct readings for the clubs i want to practice on the most. i know that this can be fixed i just want to be assured that it will be.
i was very close in purchasing a gc2 but found this thread about skytrak. i was happy knowing that i was saving 5k for a similar product. i have hit on a gc2 and i can tell you from experience that it is spot on with all of my clubs.
maybe it is my fault for high expectations on a new device. i am willing to keep this device only if skytrak makes a commitment on fixing the issues. you can imagine my disappointment when the first swings with my new LM doesn't show what i am expecting. it hurt a little to be honest.
i can't mentally adjust like you can because i need to know what i am doing. when i see low numbers it only makes me swing harder and will mess up my swing.
i hate to be debby downer but i guess every group has one. sorry.

[hks8888]

My quick first impression in my indoor session: it works like a charm for me. As i said i tried it on ipad 3. The delay is extremely long- about 30 seconds and then slow graphic repsentation. Now i got it why older ipads were excluded in the recommended systems. Anyhow i hit 7iron and sand wedges. Painfully slow but worked great. I didn't see the shortage in distance in my wedge. Just spot-on. I am so happy with it. It was a short session because i needed to give a ride to my daughter. I just dropped her off and i am heading to walmart to buy a mini 2. I will post a little more update late tonight. Happy happy!

[aryantes]

mike,
you can't hurt my feelings or feel like you are attacking me. i have pretty thick skin.
don't get me wrong, i like the product. i just find it strange that i can't call anyone for help or complain. So, that makes me a little uncomfortable.
i don't want a product that doesn't give me the correct readings for the clubs i want to practice on the most. i know that this can be fixed i just want to be assured that it will be.
i was very close in purchasing a gc2 but found this thread about skytrak. i was happy knowing that i was saving 5k for a similar product. i have hit on a gc2 and i can tell you from experience that it is spot on with all of my clubs.
maybe it is my fault for high expectations on a new device. i am willing to keep this device only if skytrak makes a commitment on fixing the issues. you can imagine my disappointment when the first swings with my new LM doesn't show what i am expecting. it hurt a little to be honest.
i can't mentally adjust like you can because i need to know what i am doing. when i see low numbers it only makes me swing harder and will mess up my swing.
i hate to be debby downer but i guess every group has one. sorry.

I understand where you're coming from, but the same can be said with pretty much every product on earth, except for the very top products of that category. Even the simplest of products, like carpenter's levels come in so many grades and precisions, some of which are $10 and some are $200. A $1,500 device won't be the same as a $6,500 device.

Precision just costs money and considering the high precision and high cost of the best devices in this category of products, I consider SkyTrak a low end hobby item. It may even be considered a toy or a stepping stone in the grand scheme of things. Maybe my expectations are not that high, similar to how I would feel if I found a place to order a $10 filet mignon.

Anyways, my SkyTrak is charging now! I'm sure I'll be mildly disappointed in a number of things, but there will be other parts of me will be quite satisfied haha.

[heynow07]

I have a new iPad Air 2 with nothing on it except SkyTrak (and the preloaded apps) and the delay is (only) 3 seconds and it is completely smooth. This seems to indicate that a faster processor may improve the delay.

[Maverick]

A $1,500 device won't be the same as a $6,500 device.

Precision just costs money and considering the high precision and high cost of the best devices in this category of products.

Electronics are the exception to that rule. FS can charge $6500 because they still have the best device. Not necessary because the manufacturing cost was high. So, your statement above is true, for now....

[hks8888]

My 2nd round of testing. I purchased ipad mini 2 and hit some balls with sand wedge and pitching wedge. They were really close to my feel. During 4second delay, I talked an expected distance to myself and the skytrak numbers were spot on within 5 yard difference. Again, I didn't see the short iron issue that some had experienced.
The games are real fun. I can play all day long.
i will take it to a range tomorrow and try to shoot some vodeos.

[wbond]

I'm seeing the issue with shorter clubs not carrying as far!!!!

I will have to try and test the 8 iron tonight as well as my GW. I wonder where the cutoff is for accuracy? Is it somewhat linear with the shorter the club the more the difference? Now, where do we go to inform Skytrak?????

I went through and tested a 7 iron, 9 iron and PW. I used brand new ProV1 balls and took 10 shots each, the first 5 are with the putting logo facing the unit and the second 5 are with no logo at all.

The 7 iron to me appears to be very close to what I see on the course. The 9 iron and PW are both about 8-10 yds or so short of what I play to. Also, on the PW, the second 5 without the logo facing the unit did not seem to pick up my draw. Not sure why, the P3pro picked up the slight draw on these shots.

Also, I went to check against the trajectory optimizer, but they call for axis vs side spin. I just played around with angle until i got side spin close. Here are the numbers. I used 0 altitude.

7 Iron-shot 4 on FS has carry of 144.8 & ST has 146, shot 9 FS carry 148 & ST 147 (Acceptable, within 1 yd)
9 iron-shot 2 on FS has carry of 128.2 & ST has 120, shot 9 FS carry 126.1 & ST 118 (Starting to see difference here, FS is close to my real world)
PW-shot 3 on FS has carry of 114.2 & ST has 104, shot 8 FS carry 113.2 & ST 102 (Starting to see difference here, FS is close to my real world)

7 Iron

9 Iron

PW