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GSA Vistrak Beta Testing

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  • GSA Vistrak Beta Testing

    We are getting close to releasing the Beta version of Vistrak. The final configuration and pricing is still subject to change. We are testing a few more lighting configurations and then we will be making a decision on the final single camera specs. Soon after the single camera Vistrak release, a floor mounted Vistrak launch monitor will be released for beta testing. I expect that the pricing for this unit will be close to the single camera overhead unit. And finally the CX surround Vistrak will be released. More information will be available next week.

    If you are interested in GSA's Beta testing program please send me a private message with the following information.

    Name, Forum user name, email address, your current simulator if any, what software you are currently using , computer specs, and whether you are interested in the ceiling model or the floor model.




  • #61
    It is operational but not tested whether it can be played on the same computer at the same time. I am pretty sure that it won't be a problem as the computer does nothing other than accept the data from the GC2. There will be a short set up. Mount the camera and light make sure that it is square. Adjust the camera settings for club data to be picked up. Once the settings are done, you won't have to touch them again. The flash of the GC2 does reek havoc occasionally with Vistrak's ball speed and direction. It does not affect the collection of club data. During the video playback, you will see some lightning. Other than that, there is not much to do. I will be posting instructional videos on how to adjust your camera settings. Martin has two big things to fix before I start posting videos. Face gets messed up on heel shots and putting mode (from Non vistrak setups) needs to be disabled or fixed to work with Vistrak.

    Comment


    • Jwheels9876
      Jwheels9876 commented
      Editing a comment
      Thanks, Keith.

      I use cobra one length forged tec black irons. What are the strips that need to be placed on the top edge of the clubs for them to be read? And can you check out how the system reads yellow balls when you get your other camera In?

    • keither5150
      keither5150 commented
      Editing a comment
      I use white electricians tape. I cut a length and then cut it down the middle to make it thinner. I just looked at your irons. They may pick up the face not too bad. The first groove is white. The system picks up the difference between the club and the mat. Lead edge detection may work on those irons. Most woods and drivers are curved so it will be best to mark woods and drivers. Even with a white head, the system wants to see a straight edge.

  • #62
    Jwheels9876 Here is a video that shows how Vistrak picks up the lead edge of the club. There needs to be a little contrast between the mat and club. As long as you have that, you can adjust the camera to pick up the face. Worse case scenario..... there will be a setting that states " Face angle adjust" When this is clicked the system will look for the markings on the top of the club. Since the top of the club is not the same angle as the bottom..... an offset will be used. There will be a default offset but it will also be adjustable.

    Click image for larger version

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    Comment


    • Jwheels9876
      Jwheels9876 commented
      Editing a comment
      Looks good!
      Can you tell me the advantages of having the Eagle with VcamB over Eagle with Hi Rez LX? Seems they give the same measured data as far as I can tell but the Vcam B is like 600 more for the package deal?

  • #63
    The Vcam B will give you righty/ lefty friendly. The Vcam B requires zoom lenses. The flashes might be different.... Not sure why there is a price difference of that much.

    Comment


    • MyEaglePutt
      MyEaglePutt commented
      Editing a comment
      Its probably because the VCam B has zoom lens so it can be placed farther away from hitting area against the wall. The HiRes doesn't have this which is why it has to be closer to hitting area therefor allowing only right or lefty play.

  • #64
    What’s happening with the videos? Any alpha testers actually play around with the VisTrak. Can you comment or post an actual video of playing a few holes with it.

    Comment


    • keither5150
      keither5150 commented
      Editing a comment
      I have sent some to Martin for approval. Putting is still needs to be coded. Everything else works pretty well.

  • #65
    keither5150:
    1. For the Vistrak LX / floor option - would you be able to comment on how quickly one would get this up and running from placement to hitting balls? Reading the GSA Vistrak Install docs...the overhead (Vistrak eagle) mentions adjusting the scaling factor in the control panel...I assume something similar would need to be done for the floor versions? I'm thinking in terms of portability, and having to setup / break down the environment (garage) each time I wanted to play.
    2. Similarly, curious on the "launch window" for the floor versions of Vistrak. Overhead version mentions 4 sq ft area - what about the floor option?
    3. Ball speed accuracy - if I understand the website correctly "up to 200 mph" - how has the team verified? Any concerns that can be shared... (I've read some of the SkyTrak complaints on the drop in ball speed measurement once it broaches 160MPH plus...).
    Appreciate the responses.

    Comment


    • keither5150
      keither5150 commented
      Editing a comment
      1. It is pretty quick. The control panel loads quicker than any of the software that you may be using. Overhead install and calibration only needs to be done once. Once done, the ceiling unit is just as fast to get up and running as the floor unit.....
      2. Launch window depends on the ceiling height for overhead units. I will have to find where it says 4 sq ft on the site as that is no longer the case. While the current camera lens combo can read the ball in a 12x30 inch area. The actual usable hitting area is more like 9x16 and the faster the shots the smaller this area will get. With the driver, you would want to place the ball in the first 1/3 of the hitting area so that more frames are capture after the strike. When I hit the driver, I usually tee the ball within a 8x8 area to ensure club and ball data is picked up.

      The floor option has been tested about 24 inches from the ball. Again, the area gets smaller, the faster the shot is. First 1/3 of the hitting area. There are still a few things that still need to be coded with the LX. For instance, still waiting for auto ball size calibration. currently I place the ball roughly the same distance from the LX every time. We have discussed coding in some automatic scaling. Once this is done, the ball will be able to be placed in a larger area.

      3. The fastest that I have tested the unit so far has been 164 mph. Seemed to work ok. Mike has a few big hitters that will be testing some beta units soon. The math tells us that a 200 mph shot will have the required amount of frames to have speed measured accurately. If we actually have a guy that can out drive the unit...… I guess we can fix that with a software update. Say for instance, the max speed was 190mph. And you hit 200 mph.... We could just adjust the cameras FPS slightly when the driver is selected.

    • keither5150
      keither5150 commented
      Editing a comment
      ParFore….. I just did some math based on placing the ball 1/3 towards the back of the hitting area. From my calculations, it looks like the Vistrak will max out at 212 mph. Anything beyond that, it looks like it will hit and miss whether the captured frames are timed so that all the required frames are in the FOV.
      I have asked Mike to let me know that highest speed that he detected. If we have someone that can outdrive the system.....that would be something to see.

    • ParFORE
      ParFORE commented
      Editing a comment
      keither5150 - thanks. Would be interested in any of the testing data that you can share.

  • #66

    A few issues that we are waiting on Martin to fix.
    1. Putting , Vistrak does not need putting mode..... putting mode either needs to be removed or modified to work with Vistrak.
    2. Hits off the heel will register exaggerated face angles. This will mess up SA calculations.
    3. Club speed at times is off.
    4. Vistrak timing of triggering the Vcam. Martin needs to build a variable delay so that the ball is captured in the FOV , regardless of speed. Current GSA users can use their LS cam to trigger until this is fixed. The delay option is there...… but there is a dead zone where the ball is out of the FOV.....thus the need for variable delay. If LA is not picked up, the club's default LA will be used. Without the variable delay, I have a dead zone between 25 and 40 mph where the ball is not in the FOV for LA detection.

    Ball speed and HA seem to be detected very well. However, shots that are really off center…..like over 10 degrees...don't have the same HA accuracy as normal shots. If somebody is hitting 10 degrees to the left or right, they have bigger problems than the HA being off by 2 or 3 degrees. Shots within 5 degrees of the centerline seem to be very accurate. Ball detection and shot detection works great.

    Martin has been working hard on fixing all of the little issues. You can expect a few updates a week to address issues. Since there has only been two of us testing so far. I expect more issues will come up as the beta testers start using their units. I will go over the issue reporting procedures in the next couple of days.


    Comment


    • keither5150
      keither5150 commented
      Editing a comment
      Update.... Putting mode is being worked on as we speak.... or I type.

  • #67
    Hi,

    Do you have a rough estimate when the Vistrak surround B product will be available for purchase? I would also be interested in beta testing this product.

    Comment


    • #68
      What would be the difference between the VisTrak Surround Sound and VisTrak with Vcam. From what I’m reading they give the exact same measurements and calculated spin. So what’s the advantage of paying more for the Surround.

      Comment


      • keither5150
        keither5150 commented
        Editing a comment
        With the surround, everything is on the ceiling. The case costs a lot more for the surround as well.

      • flightscoperick
        flightscoperick commented
        Editing a comment
        That’s it not worth the extra for a home sim maybe for commercial use. Also was reading about over head spin cam is this something that an be added on at a latter date.

    • #69
      keither5150 It's been 2 weeks and the beta units haven't even shipped yet..... What's going on?

      Comment


      • keither5150
        keither5150 commented
        Editing a comment
        I have sent a message to Martin. I too am waiting for another LX so I can test them together. I was so excited when my LX case came and then I opened it up and it was an empty case. Now, I don't usually cuss. but I let a few words go. So I swapped my standard Vistrak case. ( no longer being used BTW) for the nicer LX case. I have moved the unit to the floor.... found a few issues.... sent them to Martin. Moved it to the ceiling....found a couple issues....sent them to Martin....moved it back to the floor....and so on. I am getting tired of moving it. As soon as Martin lets me know, I will post a shipping date.

    • #70
      I e-mailed them directly, and Martin responded quickly with a target date. Given how busy they have to be, I thought it was an incredibly prompt response.

      Comment


      • flightscoperick
        flightscoperick commented
        Editing a comment
        So when’s the mailing date. Signed my contract yesterday

      • keither5150
        keither5150 commented
        Editing a comment
        First batch is shipping Monday, Tuesday and the remaining units will ship the following week. Camera and case supply has not been as quick as we would like.

    • #71
      Keither5150, I have a few more questions about the Vistrak LX. As a GSA customer since 2011 I've spent a lot of time over the years scouring the GSA website looking for information. As I'm guessing you are well aware, there is a ton of information there, but finding specific details can be difficult. Details on the VisTrak LX, and most the Vistrak products for that matter, seem to be lacking in some areas. As a result I've tried to "read between the lines" by comparing existing products with the newer Vistrak products trying to figure out details I'd like to know to prepare for receiving the Vistrak LX I ordered. Of interest to me right how is camera triggering.

      It is not clear to me what the difference are between the "vintage" LX Pro or LX Lite and the newer LX models when it comes to triggering of the camera(s). The LX Pro came with a grass fiber mat embedded with an optical trigger. When the ball went over the optical trigger the LX camera(s) fired. The LX Pro could alternately be triggered by an onboard microphone detecting the sound of the club hitting the ball.
      • How is the camera on the Vistrak LX triggered?
      • Does the Vistrak LX come with a grass fiber mat fitted with an optical trigger like the LX Pro?
      • Does the Vistrak LX use a microphone to trigger the camera?
      • Does the Vistrak LX come with a dozen balls like the LX Pro?
      I am hoping there is some sort of new camera based trigger built into the Vistrak LX software because a mic trigger seems iffy for things like putts and chips, and I'm not sure how to integrate a different grass mat into my sim setup . I currently have a PX5 system and am kind of hoping I can hit balls off my PX5 sensor mat since my flooring is custom cut around the PX5 sensor mat.

      Also of interest to me is using a ceiling mounted H cam with a floor mounted Vistrak LX. The GSA website mentions using a ceiling mounted Vistrak LX with a floor mounted V cam, but I can't find anything about using a floor mounted Vistrak LX and a ceiling mounted H cam. Hardware wise it is basically identical, but I don't know if the software will be able to handle it. The reason I prefer to use the H cam with the Vistrak LX is that I find it to be a very accurate way to detect launch direction, and prefer that to using the ball size change method mentioned in the LX information I've read. Is this type of setup possible?

      Comment


      • Jwheels9876
        Jwheels9876 commented
        Editing a comment
        So what your saying is the GSA website is a horrific jumble of scattered information on 50 different products
        I tried figuring everything out myself and still get confused on a daily basis. I'm waiting out some real info from you guys on the product in the next few weeks before I pull the trigger. Pairing an eagle overhead with my GC2 may be a nice addition if it reads clubs correctly.

      • Bubba22
        Bubba22 commented
        Editing a comment
        GSA has always been very confusing to even the knowledgeable customers. Hopefully it can get streamlined somewhat.

    • #72
      Here is my ? Was told my Vistrak and Vcam will be shipped out next week
      1. Vcam says on one page 3 to 4’ in front of hitting area and 5’ from Center line on another page it says 5’to 7’ away from the inclosure.
      2. Any alpha testers try with the light behind them like Martins new suggestion.
      3. It says Vistrak should be mounted 9’ high is 11’ to high or will I need to figure this out.
      yes is website is confusing. He just has to much going on. He needs to make it simple like all the other LM.

      Comment


      • keither5150
        keither5150 commented
        Editing a comment
        You can place it 5,6 or 7 feet away from the centerline. There is a checkbox to indicate how far your camera is away from the centerline.

        If it is too close to the tee, the clubhead may interfere with LA detection on slow shots. I recommend that the Vcam is place about 4- 5 feet from the tee to eliminate this. A delay is built in so that slow shots are picked up based on distance from the pin. This delay will soon be variable based on distance from the pin or ball speed.

        I have not tried the light behind me.

        I don't have the capability to test the height higher than my ceiling. We have a few guys that are willing to test at 11 feet. It has been tested at 9 feet and should work without issue up to 11 feet.

    • #73
      Originally posted by stevnkrn View Post
      Keither5150, I have a few more questions about the Vistrak LX. As a GSA customer since 2011 I've spent a lot of time over the years scouring the GSA website looking for information. As I'm guessing you are well aware, there is a ton of information there, but finding specific details can be difficult. Details on the VisTrak LX, and most the Vistrak products for that matter, seem to be lacking in some areas. As a result I've tried to "read between the lines" by comparing existing products with the newer Vistrak products trying to figure out details I'd like to know to prepare for receiving the Vistrak LX I ordered. Of interest to me right how is camera triggering.

      It is not clear to me what the difference are between the "vintage" LX Pro or LX Lite and the newer LX models when it comes to triggering of the camera(s). The LX Pro came with a grass fiber mat embedded with an optical trigger. When the ball went over the optical trigger the LX camera(s) fired. The LX Pro could alternately be triggered by an onboard microphone detecting the sound of the club hitting the ball.
      • How is the camera on the Vistrak LX triggered? Vistrak cameras do not need a trigger. They recognize the ball and trigger themselves when the ball is hit.
      • Does the Vistrak LX come with a grass fiber mat fitted with an optical trigger like the LX Pro? No, there is no need for a trigger, they will work with any mat.
      • Does the Vistrak LX use a microphone to trigger the camera? Nope
      • Does the Vistrak LX come with a dozen balls like the LX Pro? Nope
      I am hoping there is some sort of new camera based trigger built into the Vistrak LX software because a mic trigger seems iffy for things like putts and chips, and I'm not sure how to integrate a different grass mat into my sim setup . I currently have a PX5 system and am kind of hoping I can hit balls off my PX5 sensor mat since my flooring is custom cut around the PX5 sensor mat.

      Also of interest to me is using a ceiling mounted H cam with a floor mounted Vistrak LX. The GSA website mentions using a ceiling mounted Vistrak LX with a floor mounted V cam, but I can't find anything about using a floor mounted Vistrak LX and a ceiling mounted H cam. Hardware wise it is basically identical, but I don't know if the software will be able to handle it. The reason I prefer to use the H cam with the Vistrak LX is that I find it to be a very accurate way to detect launch direction, and prefer that to using the ball size change method mentioned in the LX information I've read. Is this type of setup possible?
      This set up is possible and will be tested ASAP. This is a great combination That will have accurate ball data with spin. You are missing club path and face angle with this combination. For a guy like you that has had the PX5 for a long time.... it may not be a big deal.

      The Vistrak cameras can be used to trigger any existing GSA cameras. Martin is currently working on the timing software. A variable delay needs to be added to the Vistrak trigger so that slow shots and fast shots are all picked up in the FOV. Currently a delay is added based on distance from the pin. Variable delay is on Martin's list. Any current GSA users can use their LS cam to trigger Vcams and Hcams until the variable delay is done.
      Last edited by keither5150; Yesterday, 02:07 PM.

      Comment


      • #74
        For current PX5 users...….. I have replaced my sensor mat with a 4x1 Fiberbuilt mat . There is no need for triggers or sensors in the mat. I have not tested the Vistrak on the PX5 mat. The PX mats sensors may interfere with the club face detection. Since the system detects a contrast between the club face and the mat...… any variation on the mats surface could cause issues with club face detection. A mat with markings on it may also cause issues with club face detection. Some mats have white lines on them for alignment. These mats are not recommended. Eventually there will be an option to use marked clubs for club data. This option will be available for users that may have issues due to the color of their clubs or issues with their mats. Please note that we recommend that users mark their woods and drivers regardless of their color. This is due to the fact that woods and drivers have a curved face.

        Comment


        • #75
          Will the Discord channel be up soon for Beta testors
          Last edited by flightscoperick; Yesterday, 11:20 PM.

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